Progman
6'4" 240lbs,rateros are not stupid.They look for easy lone targets.If you look like you could be a problem you will have no problems with them.If you are 5'6" and look like you could not fight your way out of a paper bag you could have problems.At least that is what the rateros always tell me when they are laughing and taking my money.

Specific - Yup, I usually don't have a problem. My size is a big plus (no pun intended)... I don't let my size fool me, however. There's nothing stopping a ratero from getting his hands on some sort of "equalizer" in order to even his chances. Best advise: Don't let your guard down... progman

Your size and strength have nothing to do with your chances of being mugged. The rateros are street smart and take little chances. They operate in gangs and use the element of surprise. They strike in a way that you have no chance. Take my word on it. I was mugged a couple of months ago. I was grabbed from behind by the neck. Four other guys came out of a door way and grabbed my legs and arms. I was caught by surprise and by the time I reacted it was too late. I was unconscious within 5 seconds. It was a sobering experience. Once they have you,you are done. They can take the biggest and meanest guys down in a heart beat. The only defense is avoidance. Taking cabs is the best defense. If you walk in the Zone, walk in the street so you can see if anyone is approaching from behind and can have time to react if a gang comes out of a doorway or alley. You have to be watching your back at all times.

Brother DT,
"Nothing" to do with it? I doubt that's so. C'mon, rateros ain't stupid, and they know big guys are likely to be a bigger load, and so I'm sure most of 'em would prefer a smaller guy in most situations ('cept maybe if it's a guy 6'4", 240 who's laying out on the pavement, drunk off his ass with his wallet hanging out!). This don't mean you are completely free of risk of being hit just 'cause you're big, but I'd guess it probably does mean that what are very risky situations for guys who are 5'6" are not quite as risky for you. Size probably *does* matter, at least a litle bit, even if only in visually convincing the thieves that there are better targets around.

Maybe I'll interview a few rateros on this question next time I'm there. Heh!
Brother Ritmo

Ritmo ..... Let me tell you a story about my best friend when he was in high school and high on drugs. He weighed a little over 100 pounds and routinely took down guys over 200 pounds. He did it by using the element of surprise and being very ruthless. The bigger they are the better he liked it. Anyone who knows what they are doing and catching someone off guard can take them down easily. I experienced that myself. There was nothing I could have done to beat the gang of rateros. In less than 5 seconds I was out. I am 200 pounds and in excellent shape. That did not mean anything. If the rateros target you, you are as good as done. That is why evasion is your only defense. If you are in the position where no one can get close to your back without you knowing it, you will have a chance.

DT, I think you may be missing the point Ritmo and Specific were trying to make. I agree with you that if a ratero (or rateros) mark you as a target and the opportunity presents itself, your a goner. The point they were trying to make is the odds decrease with your size and demeaner. The "amateur" rateros will not bother with you... its a fact. The crazy, desperate, or organize ones would be the ones who would try to make a play. It's human nature - the small and weak will get eaten up first!... prog

Brother Prog,
Exactly. ALWAYS some risk in the zona, even if you're the Incredible Hulk, but I know size has to have some effect, all else equal, on the decision-making of the ratties. Those muthafuckas ain't stupid--if they got a choice between the Hulk and David Spade, and Hulk and Spade got more or less the same disposition (that is, not a homocidal PCP-smokin' Spade or a drunk, half-unconscious Hulk), they gone take out li'l Dave and let Hulk alone. So the Spadesters of the mongerin' world should indeed do what Brother DT says--keep alert--and they might also try lookin' like they might be members of Charlie Manson's cult so the ratsos get the idea that this might be the wrong li'l dude ta fuck wit.
love to all my brothers,
Ritmo

The point I am making is that just because you are big and tough you should not let your guard down. My whole perception changed when I was mugged. They hit me without warning and had me out like a baby in less than 5 seconds. Dangers lurk in the zone and I want all of us mongers to be safe. WATCH YOUR BACK is the advice the locals will tell you. Also, have plan B just incase you are mugged. Have a spare car key in a magnetic box hidden on your car. Take it from me, it is a bitch to have no car key at the border at midnight. No locksmith is going to help you if you have no license, registration, or money. Don't wear valuables. The muggers stripped me of everything, watch, glasses, and wallet. Carry extra money and your license in your shoe. BE SAFE.

Glasses....Glasses...Glasses..

Swadi,

Glasses mean Nothing, IF you keep up your situational awareness!!!


StrikeEagle

Not sure I agree with that.

I tend to believe that guys who wear glasses do stand a somewhat better chance of getting mugged in TJ.

Way over half of the guys I know who have been mugged were wearing glasses at the time.

You might be surprised to hear that I agree that glasses might play a roll in the muggers decision to attack. The first thing they did was remove my glasses the moment they attacked. I believe they did that so I could not see who they were and would have a lesser chance of identifying them to the cops or coming back for revenge.

hey ritmo-if we all tried to look like we were part of manson's gang,we'd never get laid,the chicas would be too afraid of us!
a.

Just one last piece of advice. Big brothers as well as Small brothers. If your ratero radar goes off your best defense is escape. Trust me, I have studied Martial Arts for more than 25 years and the minute you try to trade punches with them you are done. I used to have Cops large and small come into my Dojo for extra self-defense training and it always took several beatings for them to realize that point. When one can't rely on a gun it's a new ballgame. What everyone always forgets is that most of these attacks will end up with You on the ground. The minute it goes to the ground so do your chances of serious injury or death.

Man this is a scary topic - I frequent that exact area and only once did I get a feeling that being jumped was imminant (the shoe shine stand 30 yards before Adilitas) Eyes were watching me in an evil way - I darted into Adilitas and went to the back - quite freeked out.

Now a question - what are the chances of geting mugged when going into the "cubbie holes" that are entrances into the SG hotels? They seem to be voulnerable positions right off the street.

Metalboots, Good question. I'd venture to guess that you have a better chance of NOT getting mugged in these little hotel entrances than down some dark alley or street. In 9 times out of ten cases you are not going to get a local to help you out - before or after a mugging, however, I think if gingos started getting hit at these little hotels they would stop using them. This would be disasterous to these little businesses so I think there would be some sort of effort to protect people from crimes (albeit - even if only reporting the after it happens)... prog

Excellent question Metalboots.I Think the same thing as I ride my Harley toward the beach West on the 94 for lunch. Any vehicle around me could really give me some serious road Rash!.. My answer is... I pretend that my back has a bullseye in the middle with 100 dollar bills attached. That is the point. Don't be paranoid just be ready for anything! And don't go alone!

This topic has been rehashed over and over on these boards and it's a good thing. The key is awareness all around you which does not mean or imply fear. Being aware is much different than paranoia or fear and it actually can make you more comfortable with your surroundings. When you walk down the alley, who is standing in doorways, the sidewalks, etc... Where are the possible escape routes like clubs, restauants? There can be so much happening in the alley way...food carts, chicas grabbing at you, bar hawkers yelling, kids wanting quarters...and rateros observing everything. A bombardment of the senses. I get chicken skin sometimes walking down the alley because there are so many eyes and intentions directed my way, and that is stimulating for me...safety first, amigos.

What is amazing to me is the amount of street crime in the Zona, when there is a cop about every 10 feet down there.

And there's a crime...about every 10 feet!

Damn i dont know what you gringos are doing..I have been to TJ at least once every eight weeks..i sometimes go alone..i have never once had trouble with anyone...I always stay on well lit streets in the zona..I am only about 5'6" tall and about 175 pounds...i dont look menacing, but walk with confidence...maybe i am just lucky i dont know..heck i even remember one time, it was about 2 in the morning and i took a wrong turn..and was walking on a dark street...it was obvious that i was lost..and a mexican guy even yelled at me at said "hey, you are going the wrong way" "you need to walk down the other street" the stranger even helped me..You posters make it sound like there is rateros and thugs on every corner, jumping on gringos...i dont know i look younger (31) look about 25..But i never had a problem...

Finally got pulled aside and frisked (cops)...once they found out i was down there for poussy they let me go. The cops gotta laugh from all the shit in my pockets, rubbers, lube, cash, anti-bacteria gel.
SB

OH yea!!! whys everything closing down at 3:ooAM...BULLCRAP!!!!
SB

I also walk on the sidewalks and have never had a problem. I have walked by myself at all hours, all over the Zona, through the alley, etc. I am 6' 200 lbs., pure muscle, and I can run faster than most people. There are definitely easier targets.

Despite all that, I am ALWAYS on the lookout for rateros. I realize anyone can be overpowered. Awareness is the key.

When I'm cruising for SG's, I constantly keep aware of my surroundings, and I always think that I could be mugged at any time. You could say I expect it to happen at any moment, and this keeps me on my toes.

If someone seems to be following me, I subtley stop and let them pass, my back towards the wall. I also turn my head and look behind me on a very frequent basis.

Show no fear, don't act like an idiot, and if a punk looks you in the eye, glare right back at him.

I have never even seen anyone get mugged in the Zona, but if I saw one going down, I would rush over to help.

-Superman-

3:00AM CLOUSURE OF ALL CLUBS!!!!!! WHATS UP!!!
SB

Brother H-Dogg sez:
"You posters make it sound like there is rateros and thugs on every corner"

Just 'cause you cain't see 'em don't mean they ain't there, my brutha...

ok, look safety is the key here..I wouldnt want anyone getting mugged, beaten, stabbed, or any other bodily harm happen to them..All i am saying is be aware of your surroundings..but walk with confidence, like you know your way around..Dont look like an obvious lost tourist bumbling their way around the zona..I do suggest that if you are a TJ virgin, its best to travel in a group. One of my friends(tj zona virgin) was drunk one time, and i lost him in the Miami bar for like 20 minutes and was scared as hell...anyway, i found them..My advice is be alert, walk with confidence, and dont look like a lost tourist..

How you look I believe does not make any difference. I am in good shape, 6ft, 200 lbs, and walk fast. I was mugged. If a mugger gang decides to take you down you have no chance. I believed the same as many until I was mugged. My perception has changed dramatically. The muggers had me down and out in less than 5 seconds. The best defense is avoidance. Use cabs or travel in groups.

I used to walked through any dark alley surrounding CC and AB without reservation until this one time about 3 months back when a mugging almost happened to my friend. It was around 8 pm and there were still plenty of people and traffic, we were heading toward CC on foot on that long street ( I can't recall the name ) that runs parallel with revolution and takes you right to CC front door. I am 5'9 and weight 195lb with an obvious weight trained built while my friend is of a smaller size and hovers around 155lb. We consider ourself to be athletic and streetwise. Constantly on the outlook for unusual behaviors, I spotted 3 hispanics ranging from late teen to early twenties checking us out. This is nothing unusual for me, growing up in the San Fernando Valley, where gangbangers are always sizing up potential victims. I kept my steady and dominant strides while looking straight in the eyes at the biggest one of the three males coming directly toward us. He was around 6' and 220lb or so, and I figured that he was the gang leader. Nothing happened, they walked pass without incident.

But then I turned around to check on my friend ,who sometimes lags behind, and saw that he was trading punches with two of the smaller hispanics that walked by me seconds ago. I rushed to his help and told him to run. We took off running a good 100 yards or so before looking back. My friend later told me that the big hispanic male had a knife on him ( he lifted his shirt to show it ) and demanded money while his two buddies proceeded to throw punches.

We were more pissed off then scared. Now, after reading all these postings, I think that We were very lucky.

Donkidik - This sounds like the same area where Downtown had his close call. Was the street called Constitution? It's the street that CC is on and intersects with Calle Coahuilla... prog

Hey Salsa Boy, I while back I think it was you who ask how many people go solo and how safe is? Anyway, I think many people go solo and the trick is to be on guard. I go solo most times but never venture far from AB or CC. When ever I do (to eat at the best taco stand around - on coahilla and martinez) I always walk in the street. So far never had any problems.

Harry

Diss-information is the best way to keep the
prices down for us regulars. Keep posting
the scare stories to keep the riff raf out of
our holes. That's what I keep telling myself
when I read these reports.

But, I did get busted coming out of a hotel
on Revolution. Fri. Jan. 26, 2001. The weather sucked that night! This was across from San Soucis. San Souci has no hotel rooms, you have to go across the street about a half block on the other side of the street to the hotel. By an official looking english speaking Mexican cop. And it took $20 before and a lot of talk before he would let me go.

The story the cop gave me was prostitution was
illegal on Revolution. It has to be in the owners
property or some bull shit like that. He suggested I try the massage parlors instead. I guess they want to make Revolution the Disney land of TJ? Clean it up so you can take your kids down there and walk around on a Sunday afternoon.

Yeah right!

I went down last Saturday (2/10) at approximately 8:30 PM with three friends and got harassed by cops looking to extort money from us. This is the second time this has happened to me at this same location. They frisked us and went through all of our stuff, and did not find anything on us, so they let us go. Here is a map of where it happened, I would highly suggest that you do not walk through this area, also meaning that you should no longer park in this parking lot if you drive in to TJ.

(Map not to scale, X's mark the spots to avoid. X's are on sidewalk, however it appears by the cops' modus operandi that it would not help to walk in the street here anyway.)

 
 |AV.|                                   |AV.| 
 |   |______                             |   | 
 | N |      |                     ^      | C |___ 
 | I  P.LOT |                     |N     | O |   | 
 | N  ______|                     |      | N |HL | 
 | O |                                   | S |   | 
 | S |X__________________________________| T |___| 
 |    _______CJ. 2 CUAHUILA (ALLEY)______  I |   | 
 | H |X                | |               | T  CC | 
 | E |X     ______     | |               | U |___| 
 | R |X    |  TB  |    | |               | C | 
_| O |_____|___   |____| |_______________| I |____ 
   E                                       O  
   S              C. COAHUILA              N 
_     ______________________   __________     ____ 
 |   |                     | AB  |       |   | 
 |   |                     |_____|       |   | 
 
            _____________________ 
           |  X = AVOID          | 
           | AB = ADELITA BAR    | 
           | CC = CHICAGO CLUB   | 
           | HL = HOTEL LEYVA    | 
           | TB = TROPICAL BAR   | 
           |_____________________| 

Thanks for the advice!!!

The above map is flopped, up-side-down, and still wrong.

I think it looks correct. Perhaps you're confusing the alley that is north of calle Coahuila with the alley that contains Miami etc which is called something like Callejon Coahuila. I can't confirm the name of the alley around the corner from Tropical is CJ. 2 CUAHUILA as I never paid that much attention to it.

Yeah, the map is correct...there is a small alley north of Calle Coahuila in addition to Callejon Coahuila to the South...

Sorry, I'm not from Australia. Where I come from, north is up. However, you are partially correct. That alley does not actually go all the way through to Constitucion like I have it in the map. It stops about 3/4 of the way there, and goes north and south from there, and forks out again to the east a little further north, where it actually does go through to Constitucion. (see my illustration below.) I would have to recommend against going into those alleys to verify this however. Hope this meets with your approval, mate.

 
       | 
       |------ 
       | 
-------| 
       | 

I have never been on the alley north of A.B. and Chicago. Is there anything on that alley worth checking out? Are there hotels and street girls like the alley to the south?

No there is nothing worth checking out in that ally!! There are no SGs or bars back there.

There are just some dumpy hotels that a lot of low lives live in. Going back there alone is just asking to get mugged!

Dimone

Stay the heck out of that alley. It is the most dangerous part of the zona. I'm not saying you will get mugged every time you go in it, but why bother when there is nothing to see. Also, if a cop sees a gringo coming out of the ally, he is quite likely to stop you since he will suspect that you may have just bought drugs.

Yep, I got stopped by a cop right there. He made me empty my pockets, and questioned what my eye drops were. He tried to insinuate that they were some kind of drugs. He gave my money back and let me go, but it was still not a pleasant experience. Even worse is the fact that there is absolutely nothing to see ... but I was curious.

-Superman-

Several years ago, when I was a TJ newbie, I became friends with a girl who was new to TJ and took a room down that alley just to get started. She asked me to pick her up one day. One of the more experienced CC girls overheard the remark and said that there was an excellent chance that I wouldn't get there and back. She also told my friend to get the fuck out of there fast. My friend moved within a month, but was robbed twice. Stay the fuck out of that alley.

Yes, highly unsafe, I once witnessed a mugging of a woman in that alley from my 4th story Leyva room. Luckily, the police were quick to respond to her screams and they apprehended the perpetrator.

-Mr416

The evidence to AVOID THAT ALLEY seems to be mounting. The gunmen that were questioned after the local police chief was gunned down in Tijuana were staying in one of the hotels in that alley.

Regards,
RickFeliz

I dont think the gunmen were staying in the Hotel (Guaduana?) The press had initially linked the hit to coyotes/polleros who hang out there. Later turned out to be a drug-related hit.

The alley near the Coahuila side does contain the last frontier for zona mongering - El Gruellense bar.

It's just too bad that they serve some of the best food I've tasted in the Zona, in the little restaurant there. Amous