Subtopic	Posts		Updated
	Archive 01	50		2002/03/24, 03:36 pm
	Archive 02	50		2002/08/12, 11:02 am
	Archive 03	50		2003/05/18, 06:32 pm
	Archive 04	50		2005/10/08, 08:24 pm
	Archive 05	50		2005/10/25, 09:27 pm

Bwana every thing you do is so <smooth> you pro. - Hemp

I received my 5 year visa by explaining that I was well travelled in Latin Countries, owned several companies and a home in Costa Rica and now planned on making several trip per year to Brazil to educate myself on its rich histiry, culture and architecture. Bam, 5 year visa in less than a week, and I did not even request it.

Bwana-

You posted in Chat how those guys got 90 day Visas. My buddy had a similar experience, only he got a 30 day visa. His passport photo looked like a prison ID.

I just dropped mine off at the DC consulate office on a Tuesday and picked it up on a Thursday. Viola 5 year visa. Must be my good looks.

(Message edited by abramom on October 24, 2005)

I remember telling the DC embassy/consulate staff back in 2003 that I wanted to make sure I would get a 5-year visa, and was told then that that was what they always gave. I've never heard of anyone not getting a 5-year from here.

Wow, never heard of a 30 day visa. That is fucked up! What did the guy do? Offer the woman working at the visa desk 100 reais for a program?

Verbage from Traveldocs website:
"Persons who are visiting friends or conducting activities other than sightseeing may be issued a more limited visa, valid for entry for only 30-90 days, for a stay of up to 30 days. The specific validity of each visa - 30 days, 90 days or 5 years for entry, or 30 days, or 90 days stay - is determined solely by the Consulate and cannot be changed."

Here's my information regarding recent 90 day visas I've received. I don't recall the agency names unfortunately, and all were through agencies (my local consulate is not very local at all).

July 2005 -- 90-day visa from Houston.
September 2005 -- 90-day visa from Houston.
April 2006 -- 90-day visa from Washington DC.
November 2006 -- 90-day visa from Washington DC.

Broman, what a hassle. Have you tried LA? I got a 5 year on my first try. AZ

My last visa was received in Oct. 2005, a 5-year visa. I applied in person in NYC (not my home consulate), and have now received three 5-year visas from that consulate.


NYC clearly passes out the 90-day variety. The day I picked mine up there was a group of guys grumbling about getting 90-day visas. The day before, this same group was talking loudly in the waiting room about going to Rio to get some booty. It's possible they were overheard I was embarrassed by their behavior.

I was holding a ticket to Rio AND Porto Alegre, and I think single men may be looked upon more favorably if they're traveling to a destination other than Rio. I also showed up at the consulate in a coat and tie. I have no idea whether these things really matter, but they can't hurt.

Good Advice. I'm surprised they didn't give you any lip about not being at your home consulate.

I think they look in your passport and if they see a 90 day one from the past, they hose you again and give you another 90 day one more often than not, so unfortunately, once you get that 90 day string started, it's hard to break out of it. I think they also look at how many times you have been and that can play a role too especially if they think you look like a goofy fuck. I'm sure they laugh their asses off at some of those photos and applications. I just don't understand why people pay an agency to do it when you can send it yourself, and get it back in a week, or do the walk-up thing like you said.

Thanks for some additional discussion, guys.

AZGuy, LA is my official consulate to use. They also have a slow turn-around time making it difficult to apply in person, and they require an agency for mail in applications. I'm inclined to try them next time, and also inclined to start over with a new visa (my current one needs new pages anyway).

I do fear once you get a 90-day, you may get a string of them. Just a guess, though, also. I have yet to hear from someone who has gotten a 5-year recently with a few expired 90-day visas in the passport already.

I have always applied at LA, in person, and it has never been a hassle. My last visa was from 2003 and is good to 2008....

My greatest joy with Brazilian Policia Federal is getting stamped out of the country at Chui, Rio Grande do Sul, and getting a long lecture about how Brazil had been fucked from day one when the Portuguese (who are worthless) and not the English discovered the place.

In LA, incidentally, I left them with an Express Mail envelope that had my PO Box on it. Within a week the passport was in my hands, com visto.

Broman, see my PM. I will try and get the guys number if you cant find it. AZ

Powerslave1 -- that's interesting. I didn't realize you could go in person and then have them send you the passport back. I get to LA a few times a year, but rarely long enough to drop off the application and pick up the visa both, given how slow they apparently are.

AZGuy -- thanks!

What are you guys told when you call the consulate to complain/explain and ask for a reissue with a 5-year visa?

In the interests of trying to collect hard data to see if there are any patterns in how and where 5-year visas are being issued, I've opened a survey:

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=324733190629

If you've applied for a Brazillian tourist visa since June 2005, I ask that you take the survey. I'll share the results here. Thanks.

I'll wait awhile before posting the complete results (still hoping for more participation -- 17 so far). A couple of trends seem to be emerging. The main one is that the overwhelming majority of people with 5 year visas did not have any 90 day visas in their passport. Statistics are worse on the individual embassies, so I hope more of you will contribute your information. Thanks.

Are you saying that the 5-year holders did not have a previous 90-day Brasilian visa? Keep in mind, prior to five years or so ago there weren't too many of us on scene in Rio. Guys like Bwana and Bomboa and those guys were the trailblazers, the rest of us didn't start going down until 2002-2003. So, for us, our first Brasilian visa was generally the five-year type, and those will be expiring over the next couple of years.

My point is, the fact that we don't have any 90-day tourist visas to Brasil may not mean a thing at all.

Cat, I asked ONLY people getting a visa in the last 18 months or so to respond. If that's the case, the data are good and I've avoided the problem you point out. It was 2 people with 90-days, and 12 people without, getting 5-year visas.

There was one guy here a few months ago who reported getting a 5-year visa after a string of 90-day visas only after getting a brand new passport. What I'm seeing so far suggests that was a good strategy. There may be a policy in place, or just people being lazy, to give 90-day visas if they see 90-day visas there.

Doesn't seem to be a difference whether you apply in person or through an agency. That was split about 50/50.

New York and Boston seem to be the best so far, and Miami the worst, but the statistics are very poor.

More data will help answer these questions, so please answer the survey if you've gotten a visa since June 2005. Thanks!

(Message edited by Broman on January 28, 2007)

So how many people got 5-years after having a previous 5-year visa?

Cat, I didn't think to ask that question. I guess there could be a number of them who still have the same passport with the expired 5-year visa in it when they apply for a new one. I should have asked it.

Broman,

Having been the person of which you speak (I did take the survey). The most annoying thing was that at one point they even put a five year stamp in my passport but then cancelled it and gave me the 90 day before sending it back (Houston). I am still convinced that it was not the previous 90 day visas but the Brazil business visas in my passport that were the source of my problem.

While I like the idea of having a survey (and I applaud the effort on your part), as I was taking it I was questioning whether it was thorough enough to give meaningful results.
For instance; in my case I had business visas from Brazil spanning the first two years of a newly acquired passport prior to applying for a tourist visa. I also had business visas for Thailand and India. I received 90 day visas through agencies from Houston (I live in CO so that is my consulate) and also received a 90 day when I applied in person in SF. When I finally received the 5 year not only did I have a new passport but I sent the application in myself for the first time and specifically asked for a 5 year in the comments section. That is a lot of information, but only that I did not have a 90 day stamp and that I got it from Houston is captured in the survey.

I think the more import question is should I call an escort girl now or just wait till mid day when I am meeting someone from MC.

The Brazilian government is strictly against sexual tourism. First to protect the minors, now they make offical statements against a US travel agency who brings soldiers on leave from Iraq to Brazil and tells them that girls at Nuth (NOT at Help) are fairly hot and easy.

Once they refused landing rights to a European air plane that wanted to land in Natal with only men. I think they managed to land in another city (Recife). Good so, as they would not have had Kerosene to go back to Europe.

What I want to say is that the sex tourism stigma probably is disturbing, so behaving like a cultured person would help

I wonder, though, what excuse for coming 6 times a year for 2 weeks each can you come up with??

And I also wonder who else would come to Rio once they get rid of sexual tourists. Would any of you guys bring your wife, and a couple of young kids to Rio? I would take them to a less dangerous country.


Maybe all this is just to keep the garota price down for the Brazilians. You gringoes pay too much and demand too little.

The survey was intended to be simple and spot simple trends if they existed. There are a lot of potential parameters as you guys suggest (e.g., business visas, visas for other mongering destinations, etc.). I've only got 19 respondents so far, and it's barely enough to pull out useful information. I think having 90-day visas already present is a bad idea now, based on the data, and Houston doesn't look like the best place to apply. New York does, but that's based on 3 reports of 5-year visas and no 90-day visas. Not the best numbers to base things on, are they?

If we got 100 Hombres to supply data, we could go into some more detailed analysis.

Hey broman, what is your research background?

I almost finished a PhD, main topics were research design, statistics, etc. Maybe we can colaborate somehow

Hey Brazil Specialist -- I'm in physics/astronomy, and do a fair amount of statistics in that work. The survey isn't that well designed, but with only 21 people submitting data, can't reach too many definitive conclusions. There are a number of places where Brazil tourism are discussed, of our sort and others, and it might be possible to put together a more thorough survey and advertise it many places.

must be aweful cold and boring this time of year there

my plan next time is to go to New York in person and beg for a 5 year visa.
If this trend of 90 day visas keeps up I may have to marry a Brasileira to get a brazilian passport.

I think it's the Brasilian government's way of saying "go to Thailand".

Sweet, you have no idea!

Dallas the person you give the forms to is not the one that actually gives the visas so begging won't do much good.

I doubt that applying in person makes much difference. A service is turning the applications directly to the consulate, so not much difference there. The only advantage to going in person is that you can apply to any consulate if you go in person, whereas, through the mail in need to go to your designated consulate. So if you actually live in Dallas then maybe you will have better luck in NY than Houston (although, I did finally get my five year through Houston).

Sweet – you have no idea. 40C temperature change between yesterday and today.

I'll ask my question again - for those of you who got 90-day visas, did you call the consulate to ask why and to reconsider? Did you complain at all?

If anything, that's where going in person could help out, you could appeal on the spot.

Actually I got my 5-year business visa essentially by begging and then being told by the woman at the counter she would try to get me a 5-year visa this time. It worked, although there was alot of luck involved.

This is my suggestion. Use a service that normally caters to Business clients. I use Peninsula Visa in San Francisco.

I got a 5 year visa, no problem.

If you are in LA and don't mind paying a service fee, these guys get a 5 year everytime.

http://www.ambassadorpassportandvisa.com/

If you use a service that business clients use, there is an assumed legitimacy to your trip. I have always gotten an extended visa to any country I have gone to when I used a service.

Landfall, How many data points for your conclusion they get a 5-year visa everytime?

For what it may be worth, I had the opportunity to question a employee of the Brazilian consulate who works in the visa office, and whom I know somewhat from his second job, about this question. His advice was write things in the comments section of the application such as I travel to Brazil with regularity in order to study portuguese, I have local friends in Brazil who I visit every year (or more frequently), list a local address. Has anyone tried these and still gotten only a 90 day visa?

OK, I used ambassadoor passport and visa as suggested by Landfall. My research indicated that LA was a good place to try, and it is my official consulate although I live almost 1000 miles away. I considered getting a new passport free of 90 day visas, but ran out of time. They aren't cheap at all, and I paid for rush service, very not cheap...but it came back with a *5 year visa*!

Question for the board. My VISA expires on May 21st of this year. I just happen to have a trip scheduled from May 7th-18th. Will I get any hassles when I show up at the airport to head to Brasil? Or at the immigration line in Brasil?

Is there a certain amount of days you have to have left on your Visa before they will let you travel?

THX

Thumper,
Not sure if its passport or visa or both. But I'm sure one of them is, you must have at least 6 months left.

No you don't. It's a five-year visa, not a 4.5 year visa, so as long as the visa and passport are valid on the day you enter, you're in good shape.

Thumper

Many countries require you to have 6 months of validity left on your passport. I would check with the Brazilian consulate and the airline that you'll be travelling on to GIG or GRU. Usually its not an issue providing that you have a return flight booked prior to the expiration date of your passport.

What Cat and Kingtut both say is true, you are more or less at the mercy of who's workinng that the day of your arrival. I was in a similar situation earlier this year and elected to renew the passport rather than take the chance. Good luck.

No, No. I am talking about the VISA, my passport is good for another 4 years. My VISA expires on the 21st of May and I am schedule for a trip until the 18th of May.

The only issue is whether the visa is still valid on the day you enter Brazil. If it expires on May 20, you can enter on May 19 and they should still give you your 90 days to stay in Brazil. However, given that immigration officers have the discretion to specify that your entry is for less than 90 days, there would be a risk under the scenario just described they would limit your entry to a period of time less than 90 days. But that doesn't apply to your case as you will be leaving the country before the expiration date of your visa.

In other words, I am agreeing with Cat.

When I left for Brasil in April the ticket agent wouldn't let me check in until she examined my passport and visa. I told her I had both and she said you need to have 6 months valid. But as CFK said, what if the immigration agent says, you will be in Brazil when your visa expires, that will make you illegal, so you can't come in, what are your going to do? Tell them "but Cat said it would be alright"? See how far that gets you. If it was me, I would renew my visa asap.

I went to the Brasil Embassy this morning. They said there would be no problem with me going to Brasil, but they did stress that I had to be out of the country before my visa expired!!

The person at the Brazil Embassy did not know what he/she was talking about when he/she said you had to be out before your visa expires. But unfortunately that comes with the civil servant turf.

The only caveat to the above is the extreme unlikelihood they changed the law in the last couple of years in this regard.

I suppose there is a possibility of a semantic misunderstanding. Technically, when they stamp your passport, the stamp represents a visa. If nothing is written on that stamp limiting the time you can stay in Brazil it defaults to 90 days. The immigration officer can also choose to make the stay shorter. You ARE required to leave Brazil within the amount of time specified either by default or in writing on your visa stamp. However, the "visa" that must be obtained in advance before entering Brazil only regulates entry into the country. If it's expiration date passes while you are in the country the only implication is you cannot re-enter the country using the same visa.

Again, I know for a fact this was the rule up until about two years ago. Since the rule is so fundamental to how Brazil regulates entry into its country, I would be amazed if it has changed, but as before it remains a remote possibility.

If a controversy ever arises between an airline passenger and an airline agent over any visa or passport issue, the airlines subscribe to a service called Timatic as the arbitrator. It is not law but if an airline agent is saying one thing and you say another, they pull up Timatic on their computer to resolve it.

You can get same info they have on-line here.

http://www.skyteam.com/EN/travelPlanner/timatic/index.jsp

It certainly caries zero weight with Brazilian immigration but if there were issues with passengers being turned away you better believe Timatic would update it in a hurry.

If the Visa had to be good for at least six months before entering Brasil, all of the 90 day visas would be absolutely worthless on the day they were issued.

Exactly Bliss, I was just about to write the same thing.

As far as the airline agent, hey, for $12.00 an hour or whatever they make now that pay has been cut 20-40% at most airlines, you get what you pay for. I've had check-in people ask to see a passport to go to Puerto Rico, so they are not always correct. I've had multiple instances in the past where I've had to ask for a supervisor to get my boarding pass because the initial agent was clueless about visa and passport requirements to wherever I was eventually going. One time I was refused a boarding pass for a connecting flight to Tokyo because I didn't have a Japanese visa. Didn't need one, but miss know-it-all "checks in businessmen all the time and they have business visas so you need one too". The one time for not having a passport to go to Puerto Rico, another time for the same but going from Hawaii to Guam, back when we didn't need passports, multiple times for Montreal and Vancouver.

Cat,
I agree with you about gate and ticket agents, more often then not, clueless! Its when I actually get to my destination, that concerns me.
I don't ever want to leave myself vulnerable to the discretion of the immigration agent. i would much rather be safe then sorry.

I was doing some visa research for future business trips to Asia I'm taking in the next few months. For shits and giggles I popped over to the Brazil resource to see what the visa infor they had there was and saw this.

Note: Some Brazilian immigration officials have been restricting single male tourists aged 25-50 to stays of up to 30 days, particularly in the north east region, in an effort to combat sex tourism.

I'm assuming that this is when you arrive in country rather than getting the visa but could still put a kink into long vacation.

Anyways the site has pretty good info for the whole world.

http://www.worldtravelguide.net/country/39/passport_visa/South-America/Brazil.html

http://www.worldtravelguide.net/country/

In the Northeast, what they're really trying to cut down on is Eurotrash coming in for underage girls.

Is there a Brazilian office in Rio where someone can get a soon-to-expire visa updated while already in Brazil? I know that someone mentioned it before but I've searched and I can't find anything. Thanks.

I'm not completely clear what you're asking. If your 5 yr. visa is going to expire, my understanding is you can't get it extended, or get a new one, while in Brazil. If the issue is that your current stay will exceed 90 days and you want to get an extension, you have to go to the Federal Police HQ in Centro. US citizens can only get Brazilian visas at a Brazilian consulate outside Brazil.

BD,

At this isn't a "Birdlips" post that you're responding to.

Superior187:

Lets give BL a break. He has been in purgatory for awhile now. Maybe he learned something.

If he has not learned anything, we can otherwise start again.

MM

Mitchc,

A trusted informant tells me you can get stays extended by the Federal Police, as I noted, but now you have to go to their offices at the airport. You cannot renew a visa while in Brazil.

That said, your visa can expire while you're in Brazil, just don't overstay the 90 days (or fail to get an extension). I think the Federal Police can give you an extension even if your visa has expired.

I read somewhere on this board in the past 2 years or so that someone had done this. I fear it might have been posted in the chat section though. I'm pretty sure that they also mentioned visiting an office in Copa. I'm still trying to find that post.

I thought you could not get into Brazil unless you have 6 months left on both your passport and visa.

MM

Nope. Your visa only has to be good the day you enter, as well as your passport. I went down in 2007 when I only had a month left on my passport.

Your visa expiration date is 5 years (or whatever the length of the visa is) from the date of your first entry on that visa.

I stand corrected. Thanks for updating us.

MM

You must have 6 months remaining on your passport to get a NEW visa, but once you have a visa you are OK. If you are entering Brazil with a visa that will expire very soon, you may be asked how long you intend to stay. They may note on your entry stamp that you can only stay as many days as you have until the visa expires. I know a guy whose visa was going to expire in three days. They took him immediately to the Policia Federal, who gave him a 90-day visa extension. Another person I know who was in the same situation was given an extension until the date of his return flight. The real answer is that customs and the Federal Police can make up rules on the fly, sometimes to your benefit and sometimes not. So it's probably best to arrive with a visa that's good for far longer than the duration of your trip.

I recently received a 10 year tourist visa (two weeks ago).

They are all 10 year visas now. And the US now gives Brazilians 10 year visas.