While I was on my way to may favorite new bar, the Marborol on Ferrocarril (across from the old bull-ring) I noticed that there were some very pretty chicas waiting along the walls of some of the buildings. Never having noticed street girls on this side of AV. Juarez, I just figured that they were waiting for their ruta. But, just before I crossed the street to enter the bar, two chicas asked me if I wanted to go to a room. At this point, the light bulb went on and I realized the previous 3 chicas were also "working". I had only crossed over to place a few early week bets on some NFL games before the lines changed (Philly –3, Miami –3, Cleveland –1) and have a beer or two. So I didn’t investigate the price or which hotel they worked out of (plus it was 18 degrees out, so I was moving fast). Ferrocarril is the street that runs parallel to AV. Juarez, but it is directly east. Obviously there are plenty of street girls on Mariscal (The parallel street to the west), because that is the zona, but I’ve never seen girls on this other side. It may be worth investigating. The nice thing about this area is there are no apparent hustlers, druggies, or other miscellaneous street scum associated with the zona. It may be just some of the local girls are looking to make a buck after having lost their factory jobs.

As pointed out by Rabidkang, the proper name for the parallel street east of AV. Juarez is AV. Francisco Villa. Ferrocarril is what the locals seem to call it (according to my scientific poll of two people)

That is interesting news. It could be that the
girls found themselves getting crowded and are
spreading themselves out. At the corner of
Juarez street and 16th of Septembre are some
inexpensive cafes with Chickens roasting and
natural fruit juice stands inside the cafe. Then
further North on Juarez 1 to 2 blocks were alot
of girls hanging around outside a cheap hotel.
This was back in Oct2000 and it was the first
time I had seen a bunch of girls on Juarez.
Usually they were on the streets west of Juarez.
And now they have spread to at least 2 streets
east of Juarez. It could be the recession in
Mexico is sending more chicas to the streets.
I am glad to know about the girls being on
Villa and will check them out. Thanks Fallen...
Que le vaya bonito

Ok, a few questions. I have always run from any girl who approached me on the street because 1) I don't know where she is going to take me; and 2) I don't know if she is really a she. Can you guys tell me what they usually ask, where they take you, and how you deal with the TV issue?

Well to deal with the TV issue you ask the girl
if she has a pussy(tienes panocha)-then you tell
her "hasta yo miro para la verdad-entonces yo pago" and you dont pay until you see her undressed. I have had them offer service for
$10. The more Spanish you speak the better the
deal. They will tell you what hotel they are
using and the hotels are usually old and very basic.
That reminds me , I have not tried
out the Indian girls yet that I have written
about in the past at the old market place
on De La Paz. Many were cute and very brown
and small......

Doc, can you also give directions to the market on De La Paz. I'd love to have an Indian girl. I will be in town the total week of Christmas and will have time to explore for a change.

I recommend you try to find it in the daytime first and remember that there
alot of of police on DE LA PAZ at night because of all of the cantinas. If you
are with someone at night they will not bother you, so I would walk with groups
of Mexicans and blend in-however the Indian girls seem to work only during the
day and then the other girls work at night. Standing in the street facing the
Cathedral , you are looking West then look to your left and running South is
a foot traffic only street with almost solid outdoor shops along its length-continue
South for maybe 100 to 150 yardsand turn left on DE LA PAZ( which last time was unmarked at this intersection
and I had to ask what street it was from a vendor). On the right close to a sign
advertising chocolate is a doorway that the indian girls hang out around and
the rooms are inside the door. Also on the right before you get to the chocolate
sign you will see a staircase that the Mexicans girls hang around and at the top
of the stair are rooms. If you continue back the way you came and continue going
East on De La Paz you will hit the produce and meat and grocery markets and
will end up West of the Cathedral and a few block south of it. In this area is
where the "Rattlesnake lady" sells rattlesnake venom. Its fun to watch the goings
on in the beauty shops, and checking out the people who come to town on
Saturday morning in the old market place. I have a feeling these Indian girls
may be an interesting experience and the ones I saw were cute so if they are
some still around then they are on my TO DO list for next time. If you see a
short American walking around looking at the girls, it is probably Porker and
say hi to him and the next time I come maybe we can get togethor.

Thanks...I'm facing the Cathedral, and I will see a pedestrian only street on my left going to the south. Walk 100-150 yards to De La Paz, which may not be marked. Turn left on De La Paz. Look on the right side of the street for a sign selling chocolate. The Indian girls are in a doorway near this sign. I think I got it. What do you suppose would be the max you would pay in that scenerio?

Well, Dreamingeagle, I would say to her-"cuanto
cuesta para ir al cuarto Y El Sexo(chingarte) y tu
todas sin las ropas(without clothes on) para
cincuenta pesos(50 pesos-about 5 dollars)-then
reach in your pocket and pull out a 50 peso
bill where she can see it. You see you have
started bargaining low and you may get what
you want for under $20. Perhaps you can even
tell her -"y una propina para buen servicio"(and
a tip for good service. You get their respect
with smart bargaining and then a good attitude
because she wants the tip. I would be willing
to bet that 5 dollars is close to what the locals
pay-that is close to 1/2 days pay for the average
Mexican.
Then getting the lowest price possible
means you can go back for as many times as
you want and never miss the money and also after
making friends with the Indian girls you can get
one for all night at a really reasonable price.
One thing you might want to do is find out
where they came from and you may have an
adventure journey to find where there are more
of them.
I hope the Indian girls are still there
at the doorway in the daytime. The ones there
before were striking looking in peasant dresses
and Indian jewelry. One time I went to Juarez
and there were no Indian girls but they were
there last Oct.2000.
500,000 Mexicans have been thrown out of
work in the current recession so prices should
be rather reasonable

Anything under $20 would be a thrill.

My whole attitude about pricing has changed a great deal in a year and a half. At first, all I could see was the bargain great sex with a young doll is for even $60.

The MPs brought it down to $30-$45.

Now under $20 sounds about right...lol.

Jaded? I guess so.

I'll let you know how it goes the week of Christmas.

Oh, yes, and since the study of all things Indian has been a past-time of mine for many years I also find the native dress and jewelry a real turn on.

One of the best times yet was with an Inca girl who was simply captivated by my playing the native flute for her. Met her in a bar.

In fact, you'd better believe that flute's coming along with me when I check this out...

One of the most pleasant nights I had on calle DE LA PAZ involved
one of the cantinas on the south side of the street. I was going into each
cantina to see if there were any working girls inside the bars and I was curious
as to what they looked like and what kind of people were in the bar. The largest
bar had a number of women sitting around a dance floor that was some 20 ft by
20 ft.. After watching what was going on I realized that it was a place where
you paid the girl to dance with you, and I saw a 19-20 year old very good looking
chica who came to the bar at night to work along side her mother. She taught
at a childrens school during the day. I sat and talked with the girl awhile
and asked her if she wanted something to drink or was hungry and asked her
if she wanted anything and that I would pay for it. She seemed over joyed and
walked with me to the taco stand east of the cantina and asked me if she could
take her mother something. We got our food and then some drinks and went
back to the cantina and talked and ate and I got the impression that on another
visit I could take her out. I believe she told me she made some 10 dollars a night
working at the dance cantina. Although I never danced with her
the strategy was to have some fun talking, seeing how the procedure worked, and
make a new friend,and also it was a test of my Spanish speaking ability. The Mexican girls all knew I was an American and were quite pleased that I had
worked hard at learning Spanish. I am looking forward to going to some of the
bars that FALLEN has written about just for the challenge to see what
I can do with girls who are not normailly "working" girls and what kind of relationships can evolve and what kind of mental games and psychology that
they might try on a "poor unsuspecting gringo"-HA-LOL...........

DREAMINGEAGLE,interesting that you mentioned the
flute because I also had thought about playing
one but I had not thought about using it to
serenade women with ...but as you found out
the girls must like it. I had thought about using the guitar but then that is not very orginal as
the Spanish even used to hire a guitarist,
or do it themselves ,to play to their sweetheart
outside her window at night...hey you might get
popular at those bars Fallen has talked about by
playing for the girls.

The "expanded zona" may have been a short term phenomena. After returning from Serena's last Sat night, I attempted to show my friend ( a long time Juarez monger) the new "line-up". He was skeptical because he had never seen girls working that area before. Well, off course, when we walked by the area there were no girls working. It may have been too early ~ 8:00, or they may have been run off by the cops. Anyway, I plan on investigating this further and will let you know what I find.

DreamingEagle, I haven't gone with many street girls. Its so much easier going to the MP. I have, however asked a few street girls to have a drink with me in an adjacent bar and if the vibes are good, I'll then take her to a agreed upon hotel. My friend and I speculated on where these girls, on AV. Francisco Villa would take a client. He felt that they were just waiting for drive by traffic. But, I kind of doubt that given the justified paranoia that most of these gals have about all the disappeared/murdered girls in Juarez. I bet they probably work out of one of many flea-bag hotels on Juarez Av. IÕll ask the next time I see them.

DoctorGood, I think I know the area on the end of Juarez Av. that you are talking about. It is a hotel right next to Senior Fogs? IÕve also seen lots of gals hanging on the stairs, but I have yet to talk to them. By the way, Senior Fogs is also a great place to take a chica, they have some very private seating in the back, plus some great tune on the jukebox.

Another fun club to talk to the chica/barmaids is 16 De Septiembre, its right across the street from the new market. The same guy that owns Club Safari owns this one too. I actually spend more time in these sort of clubs than the dancing/hooker clubs like Ano Nuevo. There a lot less hustle and the gals donÕt always have the same old hardship stories (I know , a lot of them are true, but I do get tired of hearing the same story). The downside is you can't take any girl you see to the room. But, when you do make a connection, its a little more genuine. At the very least you get to practice your Spanish with a beautiful girl!

You guys probably already know about Tragaderos resturant on the side street across from the new market (about 4 store-fronts down from the 16 De Septiembre club). It is a great steak resturant that will not disappoint you with the quantity, quality or price.

Hasta luego

The native flute is traditionally a courtship instrument, used in the way you describe the use of the guitar above. Mine was made by a Cherokee guy named Hawk Little John whose family has been making flutes at least 1,000 years. According to legend, the first flute player was the first Elk Dreamer, hence the handle I sometimes use on the Internet. The artist only used one machine cut down the long axis of the flute but otherwise did everything by hand, burning the holes instead of drilling them, etc. It's made of lighting struck poplar wood, and near the end he enlayed an image of the Thunderbird in semi-precious stones. He also carved an eagle's head for the wind hole cover and decorated it with leather fringe. It has a tone equal to any I have heard on native flute CDs. (If only I could play like Carlos Nakai.)

Amazing that these people could make a concert quality instrument with their own hands.

The music is tranquil and soothing. My neighbor could care less for it. She likes rock n' roll, and no one would ever be able to woo her with the flute. However, some women find it captivating. The Inca girl actually did an Inca dance while I played in my room, naked, which was quite exciting. I could just see her doing that two hundred years ago in some firelit lodge n Peru. She then had me lay down on the bed and sucked me while I played another song for her, which was even better, of course.

But it leaves many girls indifferent. They'd rather hear Ricky Martin, I guess...

Thanks, Fallen. If I can ever get out of my little rut I'll check some of these places out. With two MPs a block from the house and two more on convenient bus routes, man, it's hard to find the energy to explore. I'm way too set in my ways...

DoctorGood, would you mind emailing me at elk_dreamer@hotmail.com? I am leaving for Juárez tonight and then in San Jose until Thursday, but I will write you back at that time.

Fco. Villa is refered to as "ferrocarril" because of the "ferrocarril" (railroad) running down the middle of the street.

According to Efrain (if you know him, you know him), Juarez has fallen on hard (harder than normal) economic times lately with dozens of Maquilas having closed quite recently laying off many thousands of workers, most of whom are young women. This may account for the sudden appearance of many "new" prostitutes in town. Also, some of the MPs have been advertising specials in the paper, a further indication of an oversupply of women in the area. Recent visits to Michael's and El Encanto, neither of which are famous for being stocked with fine young meat, revealed that they were both well supplied with attractive young women.

I still have yet to locate the action of De La Paz however. I shall have to make more of an effort to locate this place on my next visit.

Well after hearing what Dougie said I will have
to move up the schedule for my next trip to
Juarez and the interior of Chihuahua. Usually
I find only 1 or 2 girls that are in the 8-10
range so I would be in heaven to find 12-15
angels of the street in that category.

Stopped at a club I've been meaning to check out for a year called the Chicas Playboy Club. Located on Vincente Guerrarra one block before Costa Rica. Nice club. Music far to loud for my taste making conversation difficult. 4 ladies and two customers. 1 flaca the rest varying degrees of gordita. Sat with one for awhule named Collita. Didn't see rooms in back and didn't ask. This may be a drink hustle bar and nothing more although Collita seemed like she would be agreeable to something more. We'll know more next week! I'd rate this a 2 on a scale of 1-5. Freedom sure tastes sweet!

I've got to believe that freedom has to be all the more sweeter when your soon to be ex wife has never heard the words "community proprety laws"
good luck Borderjumper, and i'm with you, 20 year old gorditas beat 45 year old white women hands down.

perorojo

Yeah, but my wife was only 33. I'm 47. This is something that never should of happened and I'm learning more and more of the "why" and becoming more pissed. Seems a friend of mine, trying to impress my wife's best friend, was feeding her tons of pure b.s. that was in turn being fed to my wife. And instead of asking my wife chose to believe it because the girl telling her had been her friend for 15 years. why these damn mexican women don't stop and use what little brains the good lord gave them is beyond me!

It's funny you should mention "community property laws Perorojo! I went home yesterday. New security doors on the back. Padlocks inside and out. Bitch keeps it all. about 20k worth of stereo, electronics, furninshings, computers and accessories. Her family just laughs. Payback is going to be so sweet and painful (and expensive) But life goes on. The bitches replacement is either a drop dead gorgeous 27 y.o that calls me every day since we met Christmas; a 34 y.o from the MP that unknown by me until last night, has wanted to go out with me for a couple of months or that delicious creature in NL, also 34, that had me at her casa last weekend. No shortage of chicas. Just a year out of the life wasted!

Fallon, send us a report on the Marlboro, your favorite new bar. I noticed it last night while driving around shit faced but as I was trying to avoid the local constabulary, I didn't stop. What's the action like in there? appreciate it!

YES!!! Tell us about the Marlboro. This is new to me. More importantly give good diredtions on how to find the place. Any information given is appreciated.

Rabidkang... Marlboro is on Farrocarril about a block north of 16 de septembre on the west side of the street. Big neon sign on the building.

Actually, I enjoyed the bar the first two times I went. Met Kathia and Maria & got both of their phone #'s. But, even though Kathia is 22 and a doll, she has 3 daughters and after just having gotten out of a relationship w/ another chica, I really don't have the time or drive to start another one with Kathia.
The bar is your typical drink & talk club. The girls aren't hooking, but aren't hard to get to know. Last time I went there were about 30 guys and maybe 5 girls. The girls, like in most of these bars seem to get a kick out of talking w/gringos that can speak Spanish.

I dropped into the Las Vegas club for a quick look on Friday. Man does it look different. Its stocked with some of the gals from Ano Nuevo & Montana. Maricruz says they are building little rooms in the back so you won't have to leave the bar to screw the chicas. Sounds like a good business plan to me if its true.