I have read many different techniques in the postings on this board, and heard stories from other mongers in BA. Some of them were actually funny.

The first feeling I get from many of the things that I read is that they are always trying to get a chica for the longest period possible for the least amount of money. Now I would be the last person in the world to tell you or anyone else how to spend money, but I think that guys really do not understand that they are treating someone like a commodity here. It fact it is a commodity, sex. However, this is not just the same thing as haggling over the price of a car. Her you are haggling with the lady you want to really to be your girl friend for some to be period of time, and not act like stiff board that does not move, and could care less if you are there or not.

Now I know that lots of you will probably disagree with me, but you have to put yourselves in a similar situation. Suppose you are looking for a job, and suppose you think that you are worth $100K / year for the pay. Supposed you took the job, but you thought you were being cheated. Would it not be hard to do your job at $50K / year when you were only being paid one-half on what you wanted?

I have decided that I do not negotiate with the women. When it comes time discussing money I just ask them what they want. If I do not like what they say, then I just pass. I find it really hard myself to have sex with a women if I do not think that she really does not want to be with me. After telling a beautiful lady that she is not worth what she is asking, and then turn around and really ask her to put herself out for me is asking the impossible.

So when a woman tells me her price, it is a judgment call on my part. If I think that the world my world will really turn on the fireworks for me, then price is usually not an issue.

Another thing that I do that others do not do, and would really disagree with me is that when the lady and I get to the room, or when you arrives at the room, I usually just get the money issue out of the way, and give it to them, and tell them that I do not want to talk about it any more. The people that disagree with me say they never pay until they are done. At this point I would say you have already trusted the lady enough to let her into your room. You do not know if she has a castration complex, a knife, or some other weird thing. Why knows, she might even have “vaginal teeth”, and be getting ready to enjoy that tool of yours just like a smoked sausage. All I can say is that I have never had anyone run out early, or discover that weird lady that might try to bite off my condom covered tool with her “vaginal teeth”.

The point is that if you are going to let them into your room to be your new two hour wife / girl friend, you might as well trust them enough to pay them, and let them feel at ease. If they feel at ease, it will be much easier for them to put out for you then trying to put out for you, and at the same time worrying about money issues.

CP, good clear philosophy for Buenos Aires. I think this works because you are older, American and most importantly in Buenos Aires. De-emphasizing the transaction in the hope of improved performance will be more likely to work in a general climate of relaxed girl friend type experiences. (It also helps that the dollar is so strong as any losses are minimized.) In the commercial hustle and bustle of a TJ, or other places where short term thinking governs every transaction, this strategy will go nowhere unless she is already a favorita. Of course, this is exactly why we like BA.

CP
I agree with you in large part,but I have found the situation to often be somewhat more complicated than you indicate. Negociations are called that for a reason. Frequently (especially in tourist situations)the asking price is not what the girl thinks is a fair price but rather what she thinks she can get from an uninformed consumer. This might be far more than what she may feel is an adequate price and , in my experience, paying such a price opens one to condescension rather than gratitude. Unfortunately, many women feel that a person who can be taken advantage of in terms of price can also be treated so in terms of service. Respect is a key element in any good relationship, but it needs to go both ways in order for it to work. As far as paying in advance...I find it a bad policy. It removes incentive and places control of the situation in the hands of the party I am least sure of. I know how I will act, but I usually have very limited experience with the young ladies in question. I have not had the pleasure of visiting BA, but I would be very surprised if the situation there was so profoundly different as to make me question these basic rules.

Mind you that I do not always pay what the lady wants, but then I will take a pass on the lady. If I feel that she is being abusive on her price, and trying to rip me off, any session with her would probably be that way also.

CP

CP-I agree with you that you shouldn´t over-negotiate because it´s true we´re not buying a loaf of bread. How you treat the chica counts in terms of what service you get.

Where I disagree is letting her set the price. The problem there is that you´re a gringo and the price will be at least double the going rate usually, so using your rationale I would be bailing a lot on the chicas.

One solution I like is Doosh´s-when a woman quotes an absurd price he tells her he is sorry for wasting her time, but he thought she was serious about helping him out and that he´ll ask someone else. This can induce a much lower counteroffer because the chica knows that you know she´s full of shit.

Thanks. I will try that sometime. On the other hand, if the chica is trying to rip me off, how do I know that she will not do it at a lower price. Once I feel bad about someone, I usually pass.

CP

What a misleading title. Shouldn't it instead read "how I pay full retail prices in Buenos Aires"? You admit that you don't 'negotiate' at all.

Porker, I disagree. This is a negotiation too. Some parts of it are hidden by assumptions by both parties. A critical aspect is getting to know the chicas over a drink and developing some connection. Unlike in TJ you don't have to ask for each specific request (shirt off? suck tits?) and how much it adds to the bill. The chicas in BA, for the most part, will deliver a form of GFE, without all the conditions and clockwatching. The deal that CP accepts or rejects, is one that he has already decided is worth pursuing. Presumably he has indicated that he is not a newbie gringo with hundred dollar bills falling out of his pockets. If she is trying to sucker him on price, after getting to know him, the inference that there will be a bad session is quite reasonable. Two simple outs for the monger; 1) no chemistry = no deal, and 2) price is too high. The positive benefit of this approach is that you might gain in quality of service much more than the extra 20 or 50 pesos.
So, in sum,this would be a stupid approach in TJ or a place like Black's where chicas are known to ask exorbitant prices.

I'm sorry, but there is no hidden subtext here as you claim, Nomar. The guy states flat out that he asks the girl her price and pays it. That's not negotiation at all, and as he says, he doesn't believe in it.

I'm not saying this is good or bad (though you can all probably guess my opinion), just pointing out the obvious, that the title is BS.

Porker. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

CP

And what basis do you have for comparison?

Guys, I don't approach negotiations in the same way as Cannonperdido but I can see in his method a decided advantage for me and my fellow BA mongers---

His projected esposa of the evening quotes an inflated "let's see if the stupid gringo will really pay this much" price...In her mind two options exist...He will say, "let's go, nena" or, "No can do, how about a lower price?" She will agree to the lower price, after pretending to be insulted and/or telling him that it is only because he is such a handsome stud that she is agreeing to a price beneath her usual high standard....


So when he says with a big grin..."NO, gracias" and walks away.....She is caught off guard. Perhaps she will not have a "date" that night....and the 150pesos she could have earned is lost because she was greedy and asked for 300 pesos....maybe next time she will not ask for 300 pesos, thereby making it easier for the rest of us.....

You might be thinking, nah, she will just move on to the next guy....but I was in Madahos not long ago as closing time approached and there were many chicas in the bar who had not been picked up....

So my conclusion is....do what works for you Cannonperdido....and it may work to my advantage as well.....

FWIW, SF_Hombre and I ran into CAnnonperdido and one of his chicas in a restaurant....all I can say is, and I mean with with much respect SF, I would have gladly traded places with Cannonperdido....

What kind of atmposphere is created when you haggle over the difference between 150 pesos($42) or 200 ($58)? There may not be a negative implication for chica performance in Mexico, only one of respect for negotiation. In BA this may be true too, but there is also an emerging apartheid system due to the currency crisis. This is an important question as the chicas kow you are a norteamericano. They know the exchange rates. They know it was dollar for dollar last year. CP's philosophy works in BA right now because of the exchange rates and the potential benefits to the monger. To put money questions to rest early, to risk a whopping extra $15 in the transaction, is to also focus on the quality of the event. The chica's performance is what matters in CP's system and the interview and abbreviated negotiation focuses attention on it. Gringo dollars make us a valuable commodity and too greedy chicas are still disciplined under this system. The chica who benefits is the ambitious one who recognizes that gringoes are a good catch and want return business. Their self-interest and yours line up, hence the surest grounds for a worthwhile transaction. I can't see using it in many situations, but in a basic BA boliche, apart from Blacks, it may make sense for saavy mongers with today's exchange.

Porker you should do what works for you.

If a chica in BA these days, asked for $200 for a session, I would just say no, and then I would pass. I would say no because, and not negotiate because you would have not gotten what she wanted. After her not getting what she wanted, and I get a lower price, how will I know that she will not lower her service? It is not worth the chance at a lower price. There are just too many that have a good up front price.

Besides, you are going to spend $700 / $800 on a plane ticket, maybe $75 / day in a hotel (already over $1500 for a week in BA), and then you are going to argue over 50 pesos. Even if you pay an extra 50 pesos per day, you trip only cost you an extra $100 US.

After all the trouble of going to BA, that does not sound good to me.

You can tell right up front is the lady is trying to rip you off. If she is trying to rip you off, why would you take another chance with her.

Do what you want Porker, but I am not sure that you get it. Having fun with these women in not about the money. If it is the money, the are some places in down town Rio that are probably better for you.

By the way, Porker, the lady EZY saw me with never asks price now, and lets me pay whatever I want. All you got to do is treat them nice, and what you get back you just cannot value in terms of dollars. After awhile, these BA ladies will do anything for you, or let you do anything you want. IT STILL IS NJT THE MONEY.

CP

PS: Thanks for the comment EZY.

As always, unequivocally, if it works, use it.

But to just holler 'SOLD' when you're read a price tag and then pontificate about your 'negotiation' technique begs the question as to whether there might be room for experimentation? To assert that it's 'only' 15 bucks or 30 bucks or 50 bucks (where do you draw the line?), when you were too much of a 'gentleman' to ask for the discount and then claim that the result was somehow special treatment from the chica sounds like congratulating yourself for something you didn't really do. So you paid full price. And you got laid. HOO RAH!

CP, you make your points well, and if, as you say, the money doesn't mean much to you, don't risk having a bad time by negotiating. BUT, if you have no experience negotiating you really have no frame of reference as to what may or may not result from the effort involved. How do you KNOW her performance will suffer? It has been MY experience (admittedly not within 7,000 miles of BA) that a quality session is not reserved for those that pay top dollar if the provider is a quality one in the first place.

Your comment about reaching a point with repeats where you pay them whatever you want sounds like an optimal mongering situation. You know her going rate and adapt accordingly to the situation depending on time and quality, and everybody wins. Of course IMO if you project this ATTITUDE from the very beginning, you should be able to get this treatment at the very beginning as well regardless of her 'quote'.

>>>So when he says with a big grin..."NO, gracias" and walks away.....She is caught off guard. Perhaps she will not have a "date" that night....

It's also very likely that she'll come back with a "Wait, how about..." If that happens, she'll probably come across with the price she's really willing and content to settle for, as the alternative, as you point out, is no money at all.

At that restaurant Ezy mentions, Canonperdido didn't know that Ezy and I were there. We spotted Canon -- or actually spotted the beautiful woman he was with first -- then recognized him. Ezy and I "just happened" to pass by his table as we made our way back to ours with loaded plates. I stopped and asked Canonperdido if I could take his plate, as if I were a waiter. Canon looked a little surprised, but not as surprised as he did when Ezy asked (in good natured fun) if he could take his girl.

This lady was not only beautiful, but had truly classic features and a killer body. That Canon knows how to pick 'em (irrespective of the price!)

Good hearing from you SF_Hombre. The lady you saw me with was Ale. A couple of her pictures are posted.

She is 33 now. If you lot to look a hot 22 year olds, she is not one of them. If you like early 30's types with a hardbody, she is one of them. She also has more brains then the 22 year old types, and I like to talk a lot so I find that type more interesting to me.

To each his own.

Nice meeting you last week.

CP

The way a guy negotiates is a sensitive thing to some guys. For me, not so much. I always think you should pay what you perceive to be worth it. I can honestly say that my first trip I did what Canonperdido did. I rarely countered and just accepted their offer. Partly because I didn't want to negotiate and partly because I got stuck in the attitude of hey..what's another 50 or 100 pesos.

However, my subsequent trips I rarely accepted their first offer if I thought it was too much. If a girl comes back with 200 pesos I never negotiate. If she comes back with something that is above and beyond what I deem to be 'fair value' than I'll tell her it's too much. The girls that ask for pie in the sky numbers have always come down when I asked. And you know what? The session quality didn't deteriorate. If anything my sessions get better and better each trip I go down there. Also many times I give the girls a generous tip if the session was amazing. (Which most are).

I don't think it makes sense to criticize a fellow hombre too much for what he deems to be fair. As long as he is happy that is all that matters in the end. It's not like he is accepting every offer. If the offer is too much out of what he considered 'fair value' he shuts them down.

Whether we want to admit it or not....sex is a commodity. True it's dealt with in a different way than gold, silver or diamonds but which I can guarentee which precious "gem" we'd rather wear..ha, ha.

Life is good.

I do criticize guys for overpaying and not negotiating because to me it's tantamount to not learning anything about Latin Culture. Rule number one in any Latin Country is gouge the Gringo tourist. Any price verbally quoted is at least double for you. Not negotiating implies disrespect to the people because you didn't learn enough to know better and say no.

Plus you raise the price for other guys and make it harder to bargain. However, I know I'm beating my head against a brick wall and there's nothing I can do.

I usually have a pretty good idea of what the going price is. If it is too high, I just pass. I just do not like to argue with the honeys about money.

There were several on the last trip that I just passed on.

I hear what you're saying Hombrecito1. Again, I think Canonperdido is passing if he thinks he'd be "overpaying". I know lots of guys "overpay" and there is simply nothing we can do about it. But cities like Buenos Aires are so big and spread out if you can speak the language a little and negotiate you'll be fine.

However, if a guy goes to a specific destination enough times I disagree with your comment that a girl will automatically give you the "gringo rate" just because you're American. Several girls of the various clubs know I am not poor but most of the time now they will quote the going rate because they know I'll say no to them. It goes both ways. I said it before and I'll say it again. A chica sizes us up the moment we walk into the door or we open our mouths.

In the end it's like anything else. The laws of supply and demand. The hottie chicas will always be able to get more and God love them for it.....

Life is good.

A very interesting thread, and one that strikes close to home. I'm in my mid 40's and just started really coming to terms with "cannon perdido". Back in the old days I'd cram 5-6 SOG's in a night of mongering (mostly TJ then). 1st few trips to Rio I'd hit 3 terma's at 2 pops each or 2 and then either the lido area or help...sigh...the world turns. I've probably got 2 good sessions per 24 hours now...maybe 3 if I'm lucky.

Anyway, I'm waiting on confirmation for my varig flight (internet special) for later this month. I'm planning on focusing on 1 "dinner date" as main course each day with possibility of appetiser (internet girl) and/or desert (club girl).

My "dream plan" would be to find "tour guide barbie" and let her set up the occasional 3-some but I realize you can't force chemistry via the net. This will be my 1st BA trip (going to Rio after) so this is really a recon mission for future explorations.

What would the appropriate rate be for an evening date. Based on great info on the board I'm guessing 400 pesos for 5-6 hrs about right. Comments appreaciated, I'll post travel dates to board when I get confirmation.

There is a good chance you might be able to find a dinner date, and Todo La Noche for 400 - 500 pesos. If you try the Orleans Cafe, I would say this is a real possibility.

People either like or dislike the Orleans Cafe. Be your own judge on it, but this might be a good place to start for what you want to do.

Good luck.

CP

As I have posted elsewhere, in November I found myself without a date for what SF_Hombre called the "Mongers Ball." I grabbed the first attractive chica who walked into Cutty Sark, told her I would pay her 350 pesos for TLN if she could leave at that moment, since we were already late for dinner....she accepted muy pronto! So fast, in fact, I may use this negotiating strategy again in the future....smile...

It was your charm that did it.

I see all of you guys points, what you think that works for you go for it, I have seen what had happen to COSTA RICA, a few years back before it got out of control you could get top rated 9's 10's for a little of nothing FOR ALL NIGHT.

Now with the internet and website more and more gringos that never been outside of the USA or never had a passport in their life," TAKE THE STRIP CLUB VIP ROOM WAYS WITH THEM TO OVERSEAS COUNTRIES" I hear it all the time guys would go WOW all she wants is $200.00 for a shot of her ass back home a girl like her would cost $500.00 to $1,000.00 for a shot of ass like that.

Now it's hard to find a girl in Costa Rica that don't want or ask for a $100.00 or more she could be rated a 4 or a 10 and TRUST me they don't want to stay more then 45mins-1hour, BUT IF YOU BRUST YOUR NUT IN AND CUM BEFORE YOU GET YOUR PANTS OFF she will be out the door with you standing there looking like a fool, there was a time when you could get those same girls for ALL NIGHT FOR $40.00 dollars or less( 9's and 10's with good to excellent services to boot) just ask some of the old timers that have moved there they will tell you how some of you have fuck up the damn place, now with the many gringos going there throwing $$$ around like a drunking sailor on shore leave.

It have gotten fuck up really bad now, and now you got some of those same guys heading to BRAZIL to fuck that place up like they have fuck up Costa Rica, The girls in Costa Rica now realize now how they (CAN GIVE OUT LESS SERVICE AND BRING HOME AND MAKE MORE $$$$), you can't really blame the girls if you was in their shoes if you got some drunking big beer gut gringo that haven't tooken the time to brush his teeth or use mouthwash after smoking and kissing every girl he met, guys just carry some small bottle of mouthwash with you so you can wash out your mouth after eating out every girl some of you sees or take time to shave and or guys that spent his time seeing how many girls pussy he can eat out and maybe fuck them if he can still get it up after a few days of whoring around, if you could get the type of $$$ why not that is some of the reasons I heard from girls that have said, that they charge Americans more $$$ No.1 they will pay it, No.2 they have said they have to put up with more shit guys wanting to take pictures videos etc. and a lot of the guys smells, (Don't get mad at me this is what I have heard ok, some of you know who you are? if you take care of yourself then I am not talking about you then, like the saying goes if you hit a dog with a car he will howls.)

I am one of those guys that is a (PRICE MAKER I AM NOT A PRICE TAKER) say what you may but it have worked for me for many many years.

You see a lot of guys have been trained here in the USA to pay girls 1st and not to get to much from them CP, I am glad you having been rip off yet by some of these girls by you paying them 1st one day I am sure that will change one day, you just haven't ran into the wrong one yet I hope you don't you seem like a nice guy.

The worst part is that some of these guys tell these girls dumb shit like "DO YOU KNOW THAT IF A GIRL LIKE YOU WAS BACK IN THE USA YOU WOULD COST A GUY LIKE ME $500.00 TO FUCK YOU" OR "IF YOU COME TO THE USA YOU COULD CHARGE $500.00 FOR A FUCK" , but, guess what they aren't in the USA but they meant can get away with charging some of you $200.00 or maybe more for a short time, I and other guys just shake our heads and say and think what a dumb ass American gringo, later I find out it's his 1st time out of the USA if you ever notice guys from other countries never seem to over pay like some of us Americans wonder why?? just set back some time and watch some of the other guys play the game or just ask them to set in on some of their NEGOTIATIONS you could learn a few things.

This could be why some of the people of the world hate the USA maybe not the people so much but that we can travel and pay a extra $$$$ for girls that they meant have to wait and get the same girl for far less.

What I can't understand is I read reports how guys would run out and pay girls $$$$$$ for a short fuck, but when it comes to staying in a nice room they would get really MAD if he can't get a cheap room or would eat at BOB'S OR MAC DONALD'S for the whole trip and say the food suck?? and dress in nasty old blue jeans and dirty ass t-shirts or shirts that haven't been wash in days or wear old dirty tennis shoes every where, most of the girls I talk to always talk about how well I DRESS in how clean I am etc.etc. and we will set in the girls would point out how BAD some of the Americans guys would dress in look (not shave) or in need for a haircut etc.

Don't get me wrong I am not saying dress to the point that you make yourself a easy mark to be rob but,like wearing a ROLAX at least make sure your pants or jeans are clean or bring shirts that can be wash in the sank or drop them off at a drycleaners or something take some pride guys, I hear all the time how we would rate the girls from other countries she looked like she had kids etc., think about "IF THE GIRLS HAD TO RATE US??" that could be why I meant pay only $40.00 dollars for all night and some of you the girls feel, DAMN IF I AM GOING TO BE WITH THIS NASTY ASS CHEAP BEER DRINKING GRINGO I AM GOING TO GET ALL I CAN FROM HIS DIRTY ASS.

There are a few countries left that I and a few of my friends can still go in get top rated 10's girls still at reasonable prices like $40.00 dollars with a tip the next day and breaskfast for all night I am sure if I start posting about those places it want be long before they get FUCK UP like some of the others have.

Some of you can believe the saying if you want to about you pay for what you get the same girls that some of you have paid $200.00 for at 10:00 pm for a 15 min fuck, come back to the bar at 10:55pm and I have them for the whole night of dancing and a few drinks and fuck them all night on your (DIME), and I pay them no more then $40.00-$60.00, for the whole night sometime until the next afternoon of them fucking and sucking me off all night long.

You see they already made their $$$ off of you, I had a few in RIO, tell me all the time if you want to wait a hour I GOT THIS GRINGO THAT IS GOING TO PAY ME $200.00 usa dollars, it want take me long he really want me bad I got him hard already, after I have a drink and dance a few songs there she comes up to me and say are you ready to go? I say damn that didn't take you long I had them say you know they all stay around the block they all stay at the same hotels or apartments they laugh and say it took them longer to get there and take a shower before and after then it took to get this gringo to CUM, some even laugh and talk about how many guys they run into that would CUM in their pants before the guys can even take them off. Some talk about how they have made guys CUM just by showing them their THONGS AND RUBBING THEIR BUNDAS (ASS) on the outside of guys zippers of their pants I say oh I see, I tell them trust me I am not like that, I will fuck your damn BIG ass until the middle of next week and when you leave me you will be walking silly !! most of them will smile or laugh and say I sure hope so, LET'S GO!!

The bottom line is this pay what you want because I will pay ONLY what I will, like any place you go what the girls don't get off of me they WILL make it back off of some of you or the next guy the key is (Treat them right like a lady make them laugh but NOT AT YOU BUT WITH YOU).

KidCisco

KidCisco, I'm sure what you're saying is correct - and it's a valuable service to those reading this board. But the sad and undeniable fact is that 99% of the guys in BA or Rio or Costa Rica (or wherever) do NOT read this board or others like it. So I'm afraid, to a large extent, you're "preaching to the choir", as they say. But the newbies around here can benefit from your advice, so "keep on truckin'".

MrBill

I have to weigh in on this. A couple of points: First, most of the girls I've been with in BA provide a high level of GFE service that is not found in the states or Mexico. The only items I've had to negotiate for up front are anal or BBBJ, and many of the girls do some level of BBBJ without asking for it, but not to completion. Second, I have only once been asked for money up front(it was the policy of the agency the girl worked for), and the session was a very good one. I've never found paying afterwards to adversely affect the quality of the sessions, quite the contrary. I think all of us have our own negotiating style, and as long as we're not overpaying and driving the market price up, to each his own.

On my last trip, I was with a fellow gringo monger who now spends most of his time in BA, and we were at Affaire where we are both known to the doorman and some of the ladies (he's a regular, I've been there maybe half a dozen times), and we were escorted in with having to pay a cover charge. I'm a very good tipper for good service, and I have been treated very well at most of the Recoleta clubs, many times being waved in without having to pay the cover.

It was after midnight on my first day in town, and I already had three quality extended sessions that day with different beautiful young women, so I wasn't really looking, just drinking with my friend and enjoying the atmosphere when a early thirty-something brunette from Columbia starts giving me the full treatment at the bar, rubbing all the right body parts, and promising me all sorts of pleasure if I would take her back to my hotel. I never even asked for a price. I think she asked for 300p first, to which I didn't reply, not because it was outrageous, but because I really wasn't interested. The next thing I know, she is down to 100p, and offered anal and BBBJ without my asking, and my buddy is giving me the "fish on hook" gesture. Hell, I took her home, spent three hours in every imagineable position, and gave her a sizeable tip because she had to work so hard to get this 43 year old canon to fire for a sixth time in a 24 hour period. I always use a condom, so I'm never easy to get off no matter how beautiful the girl is.

Understand, I never said, or had to say, a word for this girl to adjust her asking price. It may have been the disinterested technique, or it may have been the VIP treatment we received from the doorman and manager when we arrived, I don't know or care, but it was a good quality session for a very reasonable price by any standards.

I think you have to be willing to find another girl if you think you're being treated unfairly, and hopefully most of us here recognize when that happens. Later that trip, I was asked for $250 US from an aging girl at the Orleans, I won't go into the details, but I laughed her off, and wouldn't have gone with her for any price after that.

For those of you who are willing to pay any price, please do the rest of us a favor, and stick to Black's, the girls there are more than happy to charge inflated prices, some of them may even be worth it but not in my experience.

Just my humble opinion.

EZE

Eze: LOL about Blacks Keep in mind that some of the Recolleta club-babes are getting antsy and raising their prices....