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They get rings for winning the worst division in the NFL?

That is how they cheated??? stealing signs??? The British said the Indians cheated because they hid behind rocks and trees, instead of lining up with bright read coats...lol

I keep asking myself what possible benefit would they get from videotaping the defensive coordinators's signals for that game ? Perhaps the next time they played that team, but if the oposition does not change the signals for a repeat game then they are fools.

On the other hand I ask - if there is no benefit WTF are they doing it ?

km, finally someone with some logic... indeed, I can see little to be gained... why?... who the bloody hell knows. It was a real boneheaded decision (assuming it was a decision)

Could be more of a psychological trick. When George Allen was coach of the Redskins he had all the trees surrounding the old Redskin's Park cut down because he thought opposing teams had agents climb them to spy on practices.

The Pats were probably just way too obvious in what they were doing. I would think that all NFL teams spy to some degree.

I didn't even see the news or read anything other than this thread. This is ridiculous...ever notice when the coach talks to his quaterback he covers his mouth? He doesn't want the other side to lip read...

If they studied and stole signs...good for them...why are they using signs? So the other side won't know what they are doing, right? The very fact that they are using signs suggests the other side may have an interest in what they are doing...while on offense sometimes 3 guys will line up side by side to give signals to confuse the enemy as to which one is the "real" sign...another words they are recognizing that someone may want to steal them. I find this to be a team doing their homework, and find absolutely nothing wrong with it.

BTW I am not a Patriots fan.

Now if they were stealing the electronic transmission, then I believe that is covered in the rules and would be penalized.

KM: On the other hand I ask - if there is no benefit WTF are they doing it

Exactly! I can't believe all the blowhard commentary around the sports media saying that the Patriot's actions were of no value to the team. If there is no value in having the other team's signs then there is no value in strategy period.

BTW, it is reported that the commissioner met with every NFL coach during the offseason as an outgrowth of the similar incident involving the Pats and Green Bay last year. He warned each coach that this would absolutely not be tolerated. Then the Pats have the audacity to do it in the very first game v. a team they should have no problem with!!! They should be crucified for their arrogance.

Ummm I guess the Goodell the Komisar did not think the taping was so innocent . 500K for Belicheat, 250 K for the Pats and a first round draft pick gone !! Wow that's harsh !

Did anyone notice that they were playing Eric Mangini's Jets. Think he just might have tipped off the Komisar's office based on prior knowledge ? The NFL cops knew right where to go,who to bust, and what to grab.
Now Belicheat and Squealini are really mortal enemies !! Not like they were best buds before .

ya, i think squealini did em in. Good ridden to the little fucker. Having to suffer in the Jets org is a fitting ending for him.

Commish-- fine, first round picks are overrated and end up costing teams more than they are worth.

Mangini...did him in on prior knowledge?

Are you guys paying the slightest attention to the facts that are known? The whole league knew that the Pats had cheated just exactly this way last year...probably at least twice. The Commissioner knew and advised each team that the practice was strictly forbidden which warning was based on nothing other than the established cheating pattern of none other than the Pats. Coach Belicheck believes he is God and brushed the league's commandment aside because as God, he is beyond mortal regulation. A misinterpretation of the regulation? Por Favor! Blame this on Mangini?

All the defenses have as much merit as OJ's defenses. Get with it fans.

of course mangini had knowledge. Of course Bill did it to fuck with him...

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Ajqd_OGa5nUEV0pS1EDEk805nYcB?slug=ms-thegameface091407&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

(Message edited by donmarco on September 14, 2007)

haha.... whose your daddy LT? You whining little bitch.

Squealini, That is cute.

DM,
You are correct again
Many of the Pats will have rings on their fingers at the end of the 2007 season.
However they will not be 2008 Super Bowl Rings.
Also True Super Bowl teams are so good they don't have too cheat ever!

well I guess the crosses out SD... they cheated... well that crosses out the jets-- billick pointed out the broke a rule in simulating counts...

We'll see who is wearing what at the end of the year. In the meantime, I'll sit back and watch my team ram the ball down the throats of EVERYONE.

cowgirls... cough... who is next?

Peyton, your turn is coming.

6-0 is a good feat. Colts do that every year, though, don't they?

I quote myself (again) from October last year: This calling timeout a millisecond before field goal attempts is becoming very annoying and interferes with the game. Don't know why the fucking refs let the coaches get away with that bullshit when they're obviously playing games like that. Just say NOPE, TOO LATE to the timeout... Dallas actually caught a break this week as the IDIOT LIQUORED UP kicker missed, but last week, almost cost Atlanta a game.

This year it's happened 3x, and two teams lost games because of it. If the ball is about to be snapped, DON'T GIVE THEM A TIMEOUT!

agreed-- it's about as lame ass as lame ass gets. I can't wait for folks to call a TO and the guy misses it, then makes it on the second try...

Colts are going down as are the rest of the league. When do we get to knock the shit outa Mangsqeallikeapiggy again?

Well you can't take the time outs home with you, and although I hear the television annuoncers bitch about it, I could care less. If you have a time out and want to use it, then have at it. Now I saw a coach do it yeterday with like 37 seconds to go in the game, and I felt like wouldn't it better be used when you get the ball back???

Bottom line is you get so many timeouts per game, and you can't save them for next week.

DM, the Cowboys' rookie kicker did exactly that, kicked a 53 yard field goal TWICE to win last week's MNF game. That was pretty damned incredible. Janikowski ALMOST did it in week 2 against Denver, but hit the upright about 20 feet up on the second 50 yarder. It would have been good from 70 in the rare air of Denver.

Sampson, who cares if they take a timeout or not? It's the timing of the ref allowing a timeout so close to the time when the ball's snapped. If they're allowed to snap the ball, calling a "do-over" after the play is run is just a shitty thing to do.

Watching MNF in Spanish because Latin ESPN (which has English SAP) showing NL playoff game later. Their graphic showed Eli Manning weight as 285 lbs!

porker, au contraire, the cowboys kicker hit them both that game.

I guess some television announcers and Porker care. Me I don't care, and it is my contention if they have a time out and they want to use it to ice a kicker right before the snap then so be it...some time a guy might not get it because he is late...hell this may be far fetched, but a coach could actually "see something" in the line and want to put in a play to block, etc...hate to think he loses his right to request a timeout because a few people don't like the "timing".

A batter can request time out right before a pitch...basketball players can request time out if they cannot inbound the pass up to 80% of the count time...ie. before 4 on out of bounds plays, and before 8 on crossing the mid court line...

It is a non issue, that is only being talked about because of some television announcers are making a big deal of it.

You'd be talking about it too if YOUR team lost a game because a winnning field goal was taken back and you had to DO IT OVER and missed. And it's happened several times in the last 2 season. Tell me what other play in sports results in a "do over"?

DM, one of us isn't reading very carefully.

Blazers quote from February: Can you imagine Tom Brady with TWO PRO BOWL RECEIVERS, it wouldnt even be fair and the NFL would make a rule against it as Manning would never see a SB again for his career.

Obviously there are many games left to be played out, but Blazers' comment looking VERY good so far. Of course Randy Moss wasn't a Pro Bowl receiver in Oakland, Welker was 3rd option on the DOLPHINS of all teams, Stallworth got a "don't let the door hit you in the ASS on the way out" on his way to free agency, so it could easily be argues that it's Brady making THOSE guys look good instead of the other way around. Deion Branch had random games as good as any of those guys, and while Troy Brown was no Randy Moss in his prime, he put up damned solid numbers for a long time.

The guys they had LAST year, though, were CLOWNS.

AND, BTW, Reggie Wayne wouldn't be a Pro Bowl receiver anywhere else, and there are plenty of coaches in the NFL that would give Marvin Harrison a pass because he likes to run out of bounds like a little fairy instead of going for any extra yardage.

Disagree about Reggie Wayne.

It is not a due over, as it never happened if time out was called...happens in sports...pitcher pitches...no pitch, because there was a time out....I've seen 3pointers taken away in baskets because of a time out..it is part of the game...actually if your kicker got to kick one when there was time out, then he got a practice kick on the field...most don't get that luxury....

Best way to avoid this is to put the timeouts in the hands of the players only. Most of the time nobody knows there is a timeout during those situations other than the coach and sideline ref. Its a shitty thing, trying to sneak a timeout in after the ball was snapped and no whistle.

But they can't sneak it in after the ball is snapped..if they request time out after the ball is snapped it would not be granted...

What if the kicker misses the first and makes the second ? and ur team wins because of it.
Nothing says he has to make the first and miss the second. It's pretty much a non-factor.

Yes, but the players dont know that there is a time out and just go through with the play. My point is that the players should call the timeout so they could see that their is a timeout before actually going through with the kick.

But Blazers it happens in every sport...and the players cannot call timeout...only request it...the referees call time outs....a football game is so loud players don't know often time outs are called on other plays as well, even when players request it.

Torre first...Arod next.

Torre was paid the big bucks to get it done and he didn't. Basically he had to compete against 3-4 other teams in baseball with his payroll and the rest are just minor league farms teams who develope stars for the 3-4 teams to sign.


Arod...is he the MVP

Before he sign with the Rangers... the Rangers averaged more wins per season. After he signed with the Rangers, Seattle averaged more wins per season without him. After he sign with the Yankees, the Rangers averaged more wins per season. The Yankees average the same wins per season with him or without him....the difference is with him they do nothing in the Playoffs!
Where ever Arod goes they do worse as a TEAM....when ever Arod leaves a team they do better. Baseball is a team sport.....it seams that teams have no chemistry with Arod. Is he really a MVP.....not to what ever team he palys for.....those are the facts!

Dumbfuck, why are you posting this drivel in the football section?

Sorry Porker-

I forgot how sensitive you get when someone talks bad about your boyfriend. The facts prove that when ever AROD signs with a team that they average less wins......whenever he leaves a team, they average more wins. And you call that MVP! Arod creates a lack of chemistry on the teams he plays for. You can quote your statistics all you want to but he has a pattern not making teams better when he plays for them. The facts prove it....the ones that really count....wins and losses!

Actually Beachman, Porker simply asked what everyone else was going to - you're posting baseball stuff in the football thread.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7343980

This article is the hot news in the NFL right now. One of the interesting subplots of it is that Chad Johnson claims he doesn't like Hip Hop music or the culture of it that Witlock is linking him to.

Since I live in Mexico, I'm watching the Cowboys-Giants playoff game on Fox Sports Latin America. The announcers just said something that about made me do a spit-take. Just before Dallas' first offensive possession they went to commercial and the announcer said, "Quien venire? Tony Romo o Tony Romeo?

(Message edited by el_apodo on January 13, 2008)

Patriots better have their "A" game next week IF the Chargers are fully healthy. Chargers showed a lot of heart in that game and got robbed on the holding call against the Chargers that took away a late first half TD by Cromartie.

Another year of Peyton Manning having a home game in the playoffs with excellent statistics and another loss by the Colts with Manning not making the throws in the red zone when it counts and forcing balls due to Dline pressure. Give Manning pressure and he becomes an ordinary QB. He panics and throws middle screens when he needs 8-12 yards and throws deep in situations where there is good man coverage. He didnt manage the game well at all and I can think of many examples but it would take all day.

Manning played like crap in the playoffs last year and had a solid SB against a shitty team that had no business being there in the first place. Every time Manning looks at his ring, he needs to call Bob Sanders and Joseph Addai and thank them because they are the real reasons he has a ring.

The Patriots can beat the Chargers with their C-game. The Pats are going all the way this year. They're a Team. Rivers is a bitch and can't keep his mouth shut and finally the CHargers played like a team for once and beat the Colts who are highly overrated. Manning will be lucky to win another superbowl.
The Pats give the Chargers a lesson in team play and win easily 37-17

I'm looking forward to a Sunday night game at Green Bay. Nothing like arctic temperatures for a night game in January, maybe we'll have another ice bowl.

Re: YESTERDAY, Manning completed nearly 70% of a whopping 48 passes (in a close game throughout) and had more than 400 passing yards and 3 TD's. The two picks were on tipped balls deep in Chargers' territory, including one by STONE-hands CFL loser Kenton Keith, who was in the game because Addai had a sore vagina.

Did the Colts struggle in the red zone: YES. Was the running game a disproportionately huge failure in the red zone? YES. Did Harrison's 1st quarter fumble and Keith's incompetence do much more to cost them the game? Uhhh, uhhhh... If they kick two FG's there, that's 30 points, more than enough to win almost any game. 10 points on those drives means San Diego gets blown the fuck out.

On the last two drives, with Harrison out (with a sore vagina), the Colts had some dude I have never even heard of until now (he was behind even the practice squad guys all year) lined up at WR with their season on the line. After Wayne got laid out, that left Dallas Clark as the ONLY non-rookie reliable receiver on the last play, and the ball that would have gotten a first down bounced off his hands. Manning's fault, of course...

Re: LAST YEAR, EVERY Colt owes their ring to Bob Sanders, as he's a 1-man run-stuffing MACHINE, on a severely average defense in all other aspects. But re: Manning 'sucking' in the playoffs, he sure didn't suck in the REAL Super Bowl, completely unstoppable in the 2nd half against the "mighty" Pats D (that made it that far because some idiot Charger D player got stripped running back a game clinching INT by Blazers' Wet Dream Brady). Sorgi could have won the Chiefs/Ravens games, as those playoff teams had ZERO offense between them. The Super Bowl? EASY. Manning played the half of his LIFE at the only time it really counted.

Joesph Addai is an AVERAGE NFL RB in a GREAT offense that makes him look really, REALLY good because the D is scared shitless by the pass -- which leads to the play-action pass -- something Manning just didn't GET anything from yesterday because Addai didn't scare anybody. Edgerrin James was a GOOD NFL RB (before injury, anyway) in that same great offense, Dom Rhodes a slightly below average RB in the same offense. Look what happened to James and Rhodes when they took the money and ran with it.

Re: "good man coverage" -- This is something that just doesn't fucking exist in today's NFL, at least when the QB and WR are even semi-competent. Manning lays the ball out and is confident the receiver is gonna go get it. Yesterday they just didn't, at least 3 bombs dropped in the end zone because the receiver just didn't get there. Of course that must be Manning's fault... "pressure" and all. If "pressure" was responsible for a 69% completion rate, 400 yards IN A PLAYOFF GAME and 3 fucking TD's, I'd hate to see REAL pressure. You really are talking out your ass, Blazers!

Re: the Chargers whining about booboos to LT and Rivers, the Colts played 1/2 a season without Harrison or their whole starting D line. Michael Turner can RUN better than LT right now, at least between the 20's. Sproles is a better receiver. Volek's career passer rating is comparable to Rivers', who was just fucking GOOFY yelling at Indy fans yesterday.

(Message edited by porker on January 14, 2008)

When it really counted, Manning completed 2 of his last 10 passes and couldnt score in the end. Brady would have never let that happen.

Porker, this isnt fantasy football, its the playoffs. Manning padded his stats between the 20's like usual. The Colts keep losing home playoff games and the common denominator is Manning.

Did you actually watch the game Porker. Whenever any pressure was put on Manning, he looked like he was going to piss his pants and his footwork is aweful. He has happy feet reminiscent of Jim Everett. Just because Manning may have been responsible for a fantasy football win or two for you, doesnt mean he is a clutch QB. Wasnt the first time Manning choked in a big game and wont be the last. His first fluke ring will be his last.

Last year Manning had 3TD's and 6INT with a 69 QB rating during the post season. They won the SB despite him due to great a great running game(credit the Oline if you want) and an excellent and opportunistic defense.

(Message edited by blazers on January 14, 2008)

How can I argue with somebody that asks "Did you see the game?" after he only saw what he wanted to see? If 400 yards and a 69% completion % and 3 TD's isn't good enough in a playoff game, then there's just no pleasing some people. It wasn't Manning's fault Harrison had a stupid-ass fumble and scrub Keith flubbed a 5 yard pass into an interception inside the 5 costing the team points on both occasions. The game had no business going down to the last 2 minutes in the first place.

Re: Happy feet, he had them in the 1st quarter too, and completed his first 12 passes. Did Jim Everett ever complete 33 passes for 400 yards and 3 TD's in a playoff game? Did some idiot talk shit about him afterward?

AGAIN, re: last year, the Colts won ugly (and easily) against teams desperate to take the air out of the ball and not bite on play action. Blazers apparently wants it both ways, stats don't matter if one loses, but stats REALLY matter when the team WINS. That's pretty idiotic.

Blazers' next mission: Talk about how Trent Dilfer > Dan Marino, Fran Tarkenton and Dan Fouts.

I wanted the Colts in this one. I really cannot put the blame on Manning. I believe both INT's were deflected and landed in the defenses hands...sure they are INT's but they could easily have been receptions.

The more important question is why the Colts defense did not pressure the back-up qb expecially on that drive that started inside their own 10?

Entertaining game, and I am pretty sure if the Colts decided to let Manning go, he could find a job anywhere in the NFL.

blazers, are you kidding me? Putting that on peyton is nuts! Leads me to ask-- did you actually watch the game?

I saw:

* a defense let volek and a scrub back march down the field for a win
* balls squirting between receiver hands
* a team out of sync, suffering from a lack of depth, much as the pats did last year..

No peyton didn't pull the game out of his ass like Brady would of done, but he certainly didn't lose it for them.

Romo had a much worse day. In fact, Romo is settling into a predictable groove.


Let's face it, no one has a chance against my mighty Patriots. There is Brady and far, far, far, in the distance is #2, #3, etc. Plus he's plugging Giselle. Damn!

The Colts looked like a team coached by a guy who'd spent the past week researching schools in the Tampa area. They were way out of sync, and although Manning wasn't at his best, he played well enough to win.

I agree with Blazers though regarding the Chargers vs. Pats. I am the biggest Pats homer on this planet, but I realize that there are potentially equalizing factors surrounding this game. The teams hate each other, the weather can slow down the Pats, and the Chargers, although from SoCal, are a big team (especially on the line of scrimmage) that can withstand bad weather.

I am hoping that, like the Pats last year, the Chargers will run out of gas. Either that or Norv Turner will turn back into...well, Norv Turner.

I will go with the Giants and take the 12 at this point. I haven't seen any difference since the last time they played each other and the final was 38 New England - 35 New York. I also like the over of 54. That said, if there is a proposition bet out there tomorrow morning like who gets more points - Patriots or Kobe Bryant, I am gonna bet that one on Kobe.

I picked the Pats over the Rams when they were 14 point underdogs check the archives and this year of course you have to go with the Pats!
37-17

31-24 pats.

I'll take the Giants on the moneyline !!

Kobe must have had his money on the Pats for that prop bet. He had 19 points in the first quarter and made it look ridiculously easy . He slowed it down the rest of the game and finished with only 30.

He could have easliy hit 50-60.

well for fucks sake.

It's party time at the Mannings'

Nice lil profit !!

I heard the Pats lost because their mole was not able to get access to video tape the Giants walk thru .

Never seen Brady that rushed and abused.

Patriots Offensive line should get the shit slapped out of them. Brady was sacked 5 times and knocked down 18 additional times. Made some poor throws as well but I guess he was eventually going to have a bad game.

As for Spygate...Karma is a bitch.

yeah...i wouldn't be surprised if all the harrasment Brady experienced in one game doesn't match what he felt throughout the entire season.

Do you think having his supermodel g/f Gisele in town part of the downfall, ala Romo-Simpson?

She looked bored everytime the camera panned her way, just sitting there in her private box, ho-hum, what so they do with that little oval shaped ball again?

Tiki Barber sure looks like a whiny little bitch right now.

I wish the Giants would've done the "nuevo throat slash" antic that Moss and Bruschi are so fond of doing. Am glad those punks got burned.

The Romo/Simpson thing is just media bs, as Romo had some of his best games when Simpson was in attendence. If the network didn't keep showing her it would be a non-story. Same with Brady, as I am sure his bad game had more to do with the Giants pressure on him and not who he is fucking.

What an exciting final 5 minutes of football.
I was estatic. It was so awesome to see Brady get pummeled. I used to think he was a cool guy but lately he has turned into a cocky street punk.
hopefully he has learned he who laughs first does not laugh last.
Manning proved he could do a two minute drill as well as anyone. I rather have seen Favre but as long as the Patriots lost that is all that matters.
Belicheat is clearly a poor sport and a sore loser and probably one of the worst in those categories of all time. Forget the greatest team ever and perfect season crap. Finally their weaknesses were exposed and they got beat fair and square by a "pedestrian wild card team" with some awesome heroic actions who played like the Champions they are.

Milkman
Tell your betting mentor I want my money!

After watching the new Victoria's Secret ad, I think Brady needs to dump Giselle and go for Adriana Lima instead to get his mojo back. Giselle looks like dogmeat compared to Lima.

The Victoria's Secret ad beat them all! And the "timing" was perfect........

Yeah Adriana Lima is hotter than Giselle..but I read somewhere that she is about as smart as a rock. And as we know, when in a relationship, there has to be some communication between sex.

Solid808,

now there you go, trying to mix love and sex!

CFK
[I would like to compare her to Diversity's ex to see which one is the dumbest, wonders never cease]

Halfway into the season, maybe we should start this thread up again. I've always liked the undefeated Titans and they've covered quite a bit this year. Colts beat the Pats & Steeler back to back.

I'm already musing what the upcoming ads will bring. Advertising is a valuable economic factor you know

This economy is getting brutal guys. Living in Florida, I've been getting a view of it for 2-3 years now. Football provides a good escape outlet, but some of those new $500 billion stadiums seem a little ridiculous. Ad budgets are being sliced and diced while the Detroit Big 3 (in big fucking trouble) are the biggest historical Ad spenders.

Yes I miss all the Patriots fans spouting off about how great they are.

Seems the City of New York continues to humble the Pats.

The Jets defense almost screwed up but Brett & CO. would have none of that.

The Jets did what they should have done in week two as well. Pick apart the Patriot defense and punch it in the end zone from the red zone.

A nail biter but I knew the better team (the Jets) would win this game that they deserved.

Here is a drink to Don Marco who has every right to be upset at his teams' continual fall back to reality.

Football provides a good escape outlet? Try being a Detroit Lions fan as well as a University of Michigan football fan! This shit is no excape outlet if you ask me.

Yeah, my buddy, a Pats Fan, was at the $600 million Kraft/Gillette Field last night and said it was an incredible game. Since I'm a Colts fan we've had quite a rivalry over the past 5 years. By the way, Joseph Addai was a stud the year they won the superbowl, but he probably will never make it back to the old form after the injury last year. Some of the best RB's go down after 2-3 prime years. WTF ever happened to Cadillac Williams?

Tomegun, at least Michigan beat the shit out of the favored Gator last year in the Bowl Game.

Ya Cobra, Michigan did beat the Gators last year, and I didn't even get to see it because I was in the Philippines. Go figure

(Message edited by tomegun on November 15, 2008)

Giants are ripping a new asshole on the Ravens Defense. Man, what a steamroller running game.

Max, I was born in NYC and a die hard Jets fan all my life and the suffering has been intense. But I don't have the same take on that Thursday game that you did. Granted I started watching midway through the 2nd quarter when the Jets had already established their big lead, and I was watching the game in Bar Tropical in Tijuana.

From the point I entered, I didn't see a play that was good for the Jets until they marched for their final touchdown to go ahead late in the 4th quarter - that of course followed by the unreal Pats drive to send the game to OT. I just sat there and shook my head and cursed the entire time, and chicas kept asking me what was the matter. And then about to do a happy dance following the Pats last ditch play, I have to look at that implausible last play which seems like so many others that have defeated the Jets through the years.

Basically the way I saw it, the Jets offense did nothing after they got the big lead until the timely late 4th quarter drive - they did not have killer instinct and had something like 25 net yards during that time, leaving their defense out on the field for the entire half. Certainly can't blame the defense - they were tired and the Pats executed. For me, Jets fanatic and passionate Pats hater, the Pats were the best team on the field Thursday night but they took a loss based on the inequities of the NFL OT format.

But still, the game was in the most hostile environment of the NFL so the Jets did well under the circumstances to pull out the game. It is like several games that the Pats survived last year to keep their streak going though they were not the best team on the field. I am confident about the Jets future this year.

If the Jets handle Tennessee next week it won't be a long shot to predict a NY/NY Superbowl.

Believe me, it there's a Jet's Super Bowl...the "calmness" that has finally enveloped the Wisconsinites over Favre's "leaving" will erupt once again. While watching today's Pakers/Bears game (I mean, spanking) in a Northwood's bowling alley, you could almost hear, "Brett who?".

Can anybody think of a comeback in the history of any pro sport as incredible as what Kurt Warner is doing this year for the AZ Cardinals? Watching this Giants/Cardinals contest and the Giants are doing their champ thing to maintain an edge, but I feel like watching Warner this year I am witnessing history. I'm not talking about an aged or retired athlete coming back to contribute to some team's championship effort, but a player recapturing the full glory of his talent and dominance nearly a decade after the end of his original glory days...much less in a sport as brutal as NFL football.

I also realize if Warner played for a team that could not consistently give him time to pick out receivers that nothing would be different for him. But he is getting protection and he's as great as he was when the Rams won the Superbowl. Still I wonder if Matt Leinart will lead the Cardinals into the Playoffs with Warner finally splattered and broken on the sideline by the end of the season.

Seriously, I'm really curious if somebody else has any thoughts about another player having a similar comeback season in any major sport. I can't think of one. Certainly can't be the NFL where the vast majority of players don't have careers as long as the number of years separating Warner's glory years.

There's always Rick Ankiel of Cardinals. Was a very good pitcher then suddenly could not keep a pitch in the stadium .

Re invents himself several years later as a pretty damn good hitter/outfielder.
Was not a superstar at either position but pretty amazing transition and rarely done.

KM, Ankiel's story is fascinating, though this is more about reinvention then coming back. He had the talent to be a dominating starting pitcher or closer, but suddenly at the end of his rookie year and into the playoffs he pitched like he had no eyes...his pitches didn't end up in the same zip code as the strike zone and everybody from the hitter to the umps to people 3 rows back behind the plate felt like they were in danger...like nothing I think that anybody has ever seen.

There is the legend of 50's Yankee pitcher Ryne Duren who threw as hard as anybody ever up to that time, and wore these coke bottle glasses - he exaggerated his bad eyesight just to frighten the hitters - would pretend he couldn't see the signs - let a few hard ones loose a few feet over the umpire's head. But Ankiel was doing this with perfect vision on almost every pitch.

Cards played the Mets that year in a playoff round. I am a Mets fan but felt bad for him suffering this incredible nationally televised humiliation time after time. I rooted for him to get straightened out and come back, but amazingly he just couldn't recapture any control. Great unique story for him to come back as a pretty good every day player.

A poster on another site where I placed the same question about Kurt Warner suggested Kerry Collins. So two ex-Giants coming back strong years later to lead playoff teams.

Chad Pennington is another NFL QB having a very strong comeback year. Of course neither Collins nor Pennington hit the heights that Warner did even though Collins was the Giants last Superbowl QB.

okay erip, i have a comeback story i know you appreciate, how about our little mutual friend that stands next to delicias bar, i hit it with her again last night and her service has come all the way back to the level it was when i was banging her twice a week at CC

after a year of new rules and attitude she is once again at the top of her game

Drevil

I have no idea who you are talking about but sounds like a shoe in for the Hombre comeback of the year award !!

Glad to see the colts got the charger monkey of their backs. Vinatieri!

KM, what the mofo is saying essentially is that I'm going to have to make a few more trips to the clinic in 2009 than I did in 2008.

Doc, I've been having one comeback per month with her since our detente last May, and it is through the roof - 2 weeks ago just about OD'd on bliss. Paid her for 30 minutes in her ballpark and joked with the clerk asking how much it would cost to rent the space for 30 years...a truly extended session. She laughed, but didn't let me out of there for 3 full hours - not until I offered to fill her little belly with chinese food was I able to get out of there.

I guess she figured out we weren't...uh...I'm not such a bad guy after all. I have no idea what would inspire her to comeback all the way for you. But you're right, it is an all time comeback story in the sport of puta fucking.

Good to see Cadillac back in action last night, but Steve Smith and the Panthers are badass.

8 wins in a row and the Colts are in the playoffs

what a bullrush by Freeney

Great article re: Myron Cope and the "Terrible Towel"

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/30/sports/football/30towel.html?hp

I used to listen to their radio brodcast during a lot of their games with Tunch Ilkin. I loved how he used to stay "Stillers". He was an eccentric, lovable guy but had decent knowledge about football for a play by play guy.

Even though I hate the Lakers, my favorite broadcaster of all time is Chick Hearn.

Haha, I HATED CHICK HEARN growing up in So Cal. Hated the Lakers, too, and he embodied them.

LOVE the dead fucker now...

Acquired tastes are so often said to be the best?

Blazers, hope Epi can twist your arm to cross the border and meet up next weekend?

Did anyone else just see porn after Fitzgerald's touchdown in the Super Bowl?

I saw it switch off and I knew immediately it was porn. The guy took his dick out and then started swinging it around. Then the Super Bowl came back.

I am just wondering if this was local or national. And if someone somehow hacked the signal? This also happened earlier in the game, but what was running was just credits.

Interesting.

Nevermind. I guess it was just a local thing.

Local as in accidentally pressed the button on your DVD player? LOL

Xen I think it was some kind of erotic dream .

Was it a big black dick on a guy with long nappy hair wearing a red uniform ??

Have you seen the movie Milk yet ??

Xen you did see a porn clip.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090202/ap_on_sp_fo_ne/fbn_super_bowl_porn

I find that NFL end zone celebrations have gotten really out of control.

The last Holmes TD (woulda been greatest NFL single play made in history if stillers were down 4) celebration was a no-brainer penalty, and the last cards play was an incompletion.

Bluelight, sounds like Xen and the female viewers of SE AZ got a Super Bowl Bonus!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=ApXsvQAMu15dEWXKVAM5g0pDubYF?slug=ap-superbowlporn&prov=ap&type=lgns

Any guesses for 1-way AZ- ".AZ" 1 way flights booked in the last 20 hours?

That last Cards play was NOT an incompletion, it was a fumble...but of course the haters come out of the woodwork to try to delegitimize another Steelers SB win.

The open hand rule still exists and his hand did not have control of the ball going forward.

The game would have been over prior to that had the bullshit holding call not given the Cards a safety and the ball. Steelers would have ran out the clock.

In addition, I looked at my DVR of the game and that first touchdown by Ben should not have been overturned, his knee was bent but NOT on the ground.

Both teams were the victims of referee glitches but in the end, the best team won.

What about the uncalled clipping penalty on James Harrison's interception for a touchdown.

He also should have been ejected for throwing a punch!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nG9GXtr9rpY

I am sure you DVD had all the angles that the upstairs review had to overturn the TD. Why didn't the Steelers go for inches on 4th down.

Harrison should have been thrown out of the game with a suspension imposed for an undisclosed # of games next season! That sort of conduct should never be tolerated.

CFK

On the first TD that Ben scored that was overruled, he was being pulled into the end zone by one of his own offensive linemen. It must be legal in the NFL since nobody said a word about it during the time taken to review the play. But this is illegal in college - e.g. the infamous non-call when Leinart scored the winning TD on a sneak in the last second in the famous Notre Dame game a few years ago - tape showed that he was pushed into the end zone by an offensive lineman and that the play should have drawn a flag...this has been acknowledged by the NCAA. So I'm guessing its legal in the NFL, but does anybody know for sure. It certainly was plainly visible.

Blazers, the only reason Ben's knees weren't on the ground is because the AZ tackler was between his knee and the ground - so the dude's body where Ben's knees came to rest was "constructively" the ground (to put it in terms a lawyer can understand).

The Steelers won. Get over it. I was impressed by how AZ came back and almost won it. In the end, they didn't...

Great game....One of the best QB battles Ive seen in years.

Cards covered all 4 playoff games and their maligned defense played great. I watched them dismantle the Eagles in Medellin.

Video clip of Tucson TV with theporn.

http://defamer.com/5144454/defamer-rates-the-super-bowl-porn-that-accidentally-aired-in-arizona

Brady looking like a retard with his face buried in the cheatsheet on his arm.

No wonder the "living HOF QB" poll voted 14-2 for Manning...

Belicheat had the brain freeze of the year going for it 4th and 2 on his OWN 28 yard line. Way to tell your defense you have no confidence they can prevent an 80 yard drive with only 2 minutes left and no time outs. Would love to have heard how he explained that one to his defense after the game.

Belichick's fourth down decision was an insult to his defense and also Peyton Manning. The Colts probably would have had 70-80 yards and only one time out to work with had NE punted. The difference of a 29 yard drive and a 70 yard drive, hmmn, the mathematical level of boneheadedness is obvious.

GO COLTS!!!

(Message edited by copperfieldkid on November 16, 2009)

Truly one of the stupidest coaching moves I've ever seen at any level of football! My jaw hit the floor when I saw the Pats come out of the (wasted) timeout still lining up to go for it.

I am not sure what Belichick and Brady were doing there either. They were on their own planet and no doubt it was called Uranus.

What were they thinking? They were trying to keep the ball out of their daddy's hands.

18 and counting for the mighty Mannings.

Loved Brady burning a timeout when the huddle didn't match his wrist guard's schematic.

Tenn. Titans owner Bud Adams flipped the middle finger [with both hands] to the Buffalo Bills bench during their victory game Sunday. It's posted on You Tube. The NFL fined him $250,000; at least now we know what 'the finger' is worth, $125,000 per shot! Although I can't stand Adams, that's one helluva fine, ridiculous. A lessor amount or some type of suspension would have been more just/reasonable.

Bullshit. It was a first down.

The road to the Super Bowl will be thru Indy !
MY $ $ $ $ $ $ on the Colts......................

(Message edited by copperfieldkid on November 17, 2009)

Bullshit. It was a first down.

Ah the game seen thru Patriot goggles.

He was juggling the ball as he was coming back towards the line of scrimmage. The ball was spotted correctly. Belicheat could have challenged the play if he disagreed with the spot.

If the receiver executed his part of the play correctly it would have been a first down.

I don't think the call was so bad. I think it took big balls...He was trying to WIN the game similar to Parcels in years past. It would have worked against nearly anyone as the defense was focused on not getting an off-side call...

If they punted Manning would have had to go 70 yards or so...and that is not so hard to imagine.

It didn't work...so hindsight is 20/20...but I like coaches that have balls.

"He was juggling the ball as he was coming back towards the line of scrimmage. The ball was spotted correctly. Belicheat could have challenged the play if he disagreed with the spot."

He didn't challenge the spot because he was out of timeouts. If it had happened 8 seconds later it would have been after the 2 minute warning and subject to a booth review. Turns out it was combination of bad judgement and bad luck.

H1

Hungry1 is absolutely right. You must have been down the corner eating Thai food at the time ;)

While I was pissed it didn't work out-- I liked it it initially. Toss in a bad call and some great clutch playing by the Colts (hell of a toss/catch at the end no one talks about) and we get sent home with a loss. We'll live to fight another day AND the Colts hardly strike fear into my Patriots goggles.

The league's head official says spot would likely not have been changed with replay. Not conclusive.

Interesting thing on the play, if you have a chance to see the replay again watch the angle from Faulk's back.

The official who spotted the ball was at Faulk's back, no way he can see the ball and when Faulk gains control because it's the same view as the camera, you can't see the ball.

Now watch the official in the center of the field, he's on the other side of Faulk and can see the ball through the entire catch. He runs in to spot the ball where ? For a first down, just across the 30 yd line.

The other official, at Faulk's back over rules him.

No clue how that worked.

The road to the Super Bowl has many times went through the Colts. I believe they have been the #1 seed 5 times under Manning. They went to the Super Bowl once because of Bob Sanders and Joseph Addai. Manning through 11 interceptions during his 3 AFC playoff games the year they won it all. They were world champs despite Manning.

Manning is a horrible post season QB. Footwork in the pocket is everything during the post season and nobody has worse pocket footwork under pressure than Manning. He shortens his strides and gets sacked left and right. He panics and throws balls into coverage. Brady and Roethlisberger have what it takes to win in the post season...Peyton Manning does not.

Blazers has every right to not like Manning. I'm sure there are millions that don't. But saying he owes ANYTHING to JOE ADDAI is simply ridiculous. My dead grandma could average 4 yards a carry in that offense where they ONLY run when there's 7 in the box (hmmm, wonder why teams dare the Colts to run???), and Addai can't even usually manage THAT.

Like Arod doesn't pitch, Manning doesn't play D. He doesn't coach either (besides calling his own plays, something Brady obviously STILL isn't trusted to/doesn't have the KNOWLEDGE to do!).

Manning WON (and in stunning fashion) the 2 biggest games of his life in their super bowl year, leading comebacks from, at times, HUGE deficits the last two games. I guess Blazers thinks the super bowl MVP was some sort of a lifetime achievement award?

No one has EVER controlled an offense like Manning has, and no offense has ever put up such sustained excellence in offensive numbers. Of course, the team that loses their last game of the year (like all but 1 do...) must have a flawed leader, right?

Manning's single worst game of a given season has come in the post season many, many times in his carear according to QB Passer Rating.

The worst performances of his carear have come in the postseason according to QB Passer Rating.

In 9 season in the postseason the Colts were 1 and down in 6 of the 9 under Manning, and if not for his defense bailing him out, in the opening game the year they won the SB it would have been 7 of 9.

In the opening game against KC, Manning is one of the very few QB's in history who's team survived in the postseason while throwing 3 int, but thanks to his defense the Colts survived, and he did not fair much better the next week in Baltimore.

Well of course his single worse game would come in playoff games...that is he is battling the best teams....I bet if the Jets, Browns and Raiders were in the playoffs he would have had great games.

I'm not sold on this Colts team, but they are one of the top 4 in the AFC for sure.

Looks like I should have an easy time of it getting some of the above guys to wager against Manning and the Colts. I'm looking forward to it. Don't forget, no one T-E-A-M is unbeaten because of just one individual, those guys are clicking both defensively and offensively. So what if one game the defense wins it for them, and the next the offense. That's what it's all about.

Vince Young and the Titans just handed the Texans ANOTHER loss! Congrats to Vince for proving once again to Bob McNair [loser] how stupid he was for not picking him in the draft in the first place when he had the chance.

Nice game, Tom Brady.

And Pittsburgh screws the pooch and bends over against the dregs of the league in November and can't even make the playoffs.

Depressing enough to make Blazers want to scratch the dark-side ladyboy itch in TJ???

Blazers: Repeat after me: Peyton Manning is my Daddy, my Stepdaddy, the guy that cuckolded my Mom!

Payton may be Blazers daddy, but I am still predicting that after sleeping through the last couple games of the season, Indy won't be able to take down the Chargers in the finals. And I am not a Chargers fan (born in Chi live in CO, so not admiting to the two teams I am a fan of).

Dallas vs. SD at the end, hard to pick which team I will want to lose more in that matchup

I was shocked the Chargers lost today, but that's what happens when your kicker shits his pants on every kick and Rivers looked as overmatched as Romo did on crucial boneheaded plays.

Colts going to the Super Bowl without much sweating. I think they'd better be rooting for New Orleans, but the NFL wants Favre vs. Manning, so it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to think they'd find a way to make that happen.

Well at least the Chargers are predictable, they fold like a house of cards when they get into the playoffs....Oh and RIVERS SUCKS ASS!! I predict a lot of Chargers fans will be wearing their old Drew Brees #9 jerseys around town next week.

Well I sure called this weekend wrong. I don't even know if I can make a call for Sunday.

Porker is right on, the NFL is drooling over a Indy-Minn matchup.

Drew was tough Saturday, but Minn does actually have a rush so it will be a little different. I'll have to be rooting for a NO vs. Jets bowl. Always liked Brees because of his PU/Big Ten roots, and I do think he is the best passer in the game right now.

I think that New Orleans-Indy is just as good for the NFL as Minnesota getting in. It's really too hard to predict on the NFC side, the early line is Minn giving 3.5, I think that's real generous with New Orleans playing at home. I'll take those points and take New Orleans. I don't know if they'll win but I think it will be a close game.

On the AFC side, the early line is Indy giving 7, and I'll take Indy at that rate.

NO vs. Indy with NO taking it home.

You heard it here.

Uh, Cat, you got the line backwards. Saints -4 to 4 1/2 right now. As you said, Saints are at home. For what it's worth, Favre has been almost human in road games this year. I still wouldn't bet against him right now.

I think the vikes-saints over/under is gonna grow very quickly from the 53 it's at now. Both teams get turnovers=easy points, plus harvin and bush running back kicks...

You are correct, I must have read it wrong earlier. In that case, I'm not really sure as I think New Orleans will win, I just anticipate a very close game.

Ok, I'll be the only one to pick the Jets here. Jets v. Minny.

Not just because I'm a 45 year Jets fan - I picked the Chargers to win outright (but Jets to cover the spread), and would favor Minny in the Super Bowl no matter who shows up from the AFC - Brett so ironically defeating his team from last year. Where would the Jets be with healthy Brett playing for them this year?

You guys have forgotten that Indy's season really has been characterized by smoke and mirrors. SD is an all around more talented team, and the Jets are an all around more talented team. Indy's got the X factor - a HOF QB who can pack magic up his sleeve on any given day and they've needed his magic to survive several games this year.

Indy ground game is DEAD LAST and plays right into the hands of chaos creating Jets defense. Manning is capable of throwing balls to the wrong uniforms and look for that to happen a couple of times on Sunday.

Jets strengths - no. 1 by far in major defensive categories and rushing, are like bringing the best pitching and defense to the World Series...gives you a serious leg up. Those are the classic core building blocks of champions.

They struggled this year with key injuries to their best players on offense and defense, a red shirt freshman at QB, and a freshman head coach. That's past - though I still see Sanchez at this stage of his development as a weak link.

Bottom line, Indy's success was a mirage and so was the Jets' midseason struggle. Home field advantage means nothing at this point. Jets win outright, barring magic.

They were 14 3/4 and OH with "smoke and mirrors"?

Colts started off the year with Manning throwing at will but got a lot more conservative as the year went on (dangerous for ANY team) and Manning had to pull out some games that were too close to comfort. But you don't go 14-0 without being a damned good team.

Re: rushing stats, if I called the plays for the Colts, I'd throw every fucking down.

Your brilliant upset prediction has one flaw -- how in the fuck is a team with ZERO pass offense gonna outscore the Colts? Colts are stone-cold LOCK to score 20+ points, and should easily get to mid-20's if they don't sit on the ball in the 2nd half trying to run clock. Jets chances of scoring 20 without something fluky like a kick return for a TD?

ZIP.

No way the Jets stop Manning and no way they win.

It is the Chargers who hold the all time record until 28 hours ago for consecutive games scoring 20 or more points.

I don't know - not a statistics geek if they aren't laid out in front of me. Did the Chargers score less than the Colts this year?

It is an open question whether the Jets can score more than they have been - they certainly aren't near the bottom in scoring this year and beat Cincy 37-0 in the season final. They have an operating philosophy that if the defense holds down the other team, they'll play conservative as hell to protect Sanchez and his confidence. I think the team confidence is so high now that they may surprise people as to what they could do in the air game if it came down to that. But it doesn't. They gave up an average of 14 per game and didn't give up 20 or more in at least the last 8 games.

NFL football teams transition all the time within the same season and wow has that been the case league wide this season. The Jets have transitioned to a level of maturity and confidence and discovered and developed young talent, which makes them plenty scary for any opponent right now. Sanchez's rookie season is over. Yesterday is over. Mother MO is on their side just at the right time.

And besides, all Charger playoff vanquishers go on to win the Super Bowl - but I'm not going that far.

Erip,

It is so hard to go against Manning, who while I believe is no longer the passer he once was, is still the best QB at running the show without question. But those Jets are on such a high it is unbelievable. They can basically just ignore the run and see what happens. Back to Manning, though, he is better than anyone at recognizing and finding the open man (men) in a blitz. So it will be a great matchup, the best blitzing D against the best being blitzed QB.

I don't believe the Colts can really stop the Jets running game. Jets don't put up the points but with ball control they don't need to, just need to play keep away with the Colts offense.

I don't think the Jets can really pull it off, but it will be close and they are going to be a score away when it ends. Just my opinion.

The Jets are toast. The Chargers lost that game more than the Jets won it...

Comparing talent Jets vs Colts is laughable-- of course miracles sometime do happen. NO all the way.

It is time.

A really good friend of mine, the guy I watch games with every Sunday is an obnoxious Vikings fan. I just will not be able to deal with him if they make the Super Bowl.

Viking have shown a pretty good rush. Brees is going to need to beat it, unlike last week where he could sit and have a smoke in the pocket. I do think they can pull it out being at home, but honestly after last week, I just don't know. I really did not think they had a chance against the Cowboys the way the Cowboys were playing at the time.

This is one of the years when I have no problem with any of the possible conference champs. Indy is ok, I like Manning. The Jets, they haven't won since before I was born so they're due. New Orleans is a great story all around, and I like Favre and the Vikings haven't been in a Super Bowl in decades.

I would have liked to have seen a San Diege-New Orleans Super Bowl, but I'll be happy with any of the possible combos left. As long as the Eagles, Giants and especially the Cowboys are out of it - and the Ravens, I hate their brand of football - I'm at ease.

Don Marco: Comparing talent Jets vs Colts is laughabl

OK, I'm calling you out on that one Don Marco. You are punch drunk on superstar aura. Even if the Colts have more overall talent, which they most certainly do not, to say the comparison is laughable in favor of the Colts is laughable hyberbolic analysis. Fair enough since I have been guilty at times, of ruling the kingdom of Hyperbole. I know the place and you are currently there. Are their hookers in Hyperbole?

But C'mon. Exactly what aspect of the Indy team is more talented than their counterparts on the Jets other than QB, wide receivers (and I'm strongly dubious about that one - but Manning feeds them), and the Jets poor kickoff coverage? Obviously the Jets have better backs, offensive and defensive. Their O-Line is considered the best in the game by many or most qualified analysts - they push defenses back and they protect Sanchez who may be the least pressured QB in the league - and needs to be as he does the least under pressure of any QB I can think of. The defensive personnel is too obvious to even discuss in light of the tangible numbers.

The Colts are flash and hype, and the Jets are tough meat and substance, which is not all that antithetical to the game of Pro Football.

The Colts may very well win this game - it's not like I'm going to be in a state of shock if the Jets lose. If the Colts win it will be on the back of one very special talent and not a laughable advantage in overall talent. Your comment suggests that you believe the Jets would lose if they had Manning and the Colts had Sanchez.

As good as Manning is, he has brought exactly one Lombardi Trophy to Indy. This is probably, the smoky record aside, one of the least overall talented teams Manning has led.

I like Manning and the Colts. I am not a hater (except when it comes to the Raiders). If the Jets don't get 'em, the NFC will.

The prop I like the most of is the under of 39, but I would take the Colts to cover also.

Erip, Manning, Wayne, Saturday, Freeney all going to the Hall of Fame, all still producing at a Pro Bowl level. Dallas Clark had one of the great pass catching seasons in TE history, and when there are only a handful of TE's in the Hall, that gets you into a conversation.

And Bob Sanders is on IR again...

The Jets?

They have Revis. That team was 7-7 in a division with two PATSIES for a reason.

Jets O line, OK, they're good, but when you talk about pass protection, talk about a guy that never even gets TOUCHED, it's Manning.

Which team is more likely to pressure the QB this week? Uhmmmm... You admit that Sanchez plays poorly under pressure (all rookies do). The game he puts up will NOT be pretty.

Porker still has his fantasy football trophy's so far up his ass that he hasn't realized that Peyton Manning is absolutely AWFUL in the post season...HORRIBLE.

The one year that Indy did win the title, it had nothing to do with Manning. Manning threw 11 interceptions during the 3 AFC playoff games and tried his best to give the games away. It was the defense and their running game that got them to the SB and Manning had a solid game in the SB against maybe the worst team ever to appear in a SB in the CHicago Bears.

At least Roethlisberger was beyond stellar during the 3 AFC road games for his first SB ring, even though he was awful in the SB.

As for comparing talent. The Jets have a better defense top to bottom and their stats show it. They are stellar against the run and have the best set of coverage linebackers in the NFL. Bart Scott is a superstud. Lastly, who would you pick to coach your team in a big game...I am guessing you are intelligent enough to admit that Ryan is a much better coach.

Wayne and Manning are definately better at their position. Freeney hasn't been a good DE in a while. Clark is a stud but the Jets have a great compliment of TE's that have done well. I look at Clark as more of an H-back, similar to Cooley. Blocking is also part of the TE position and Clark is possibly the worst in football.

(Message edited by blazers on January 20, 2010)

As usual, Blazers' relationship with the FACTS when talking about sports is fast and loose. In the Colts' Super Bowl year, Manning did have a horrible game against Baltimore (that his team won easily. A Joe Flacco type game from the 1st round of this year's playoffs against New England), but the others were at least decent, and Manning WON the biggest game he'd ever played at that point in his career, the championship game against New England in their Super Bowl year after his team was waaaay behind in the 2nd quarter. He's thrown for 700+ in the two losses to San Diego the last two years and averaged 300 in season ending losses the two years before that. Crennel used to have his # in the playoffs way back when in the wind and cold in New England, but those days are long, long gone, and I doubt Manning will ever play another outdoor playoff game.

And they never lost as ugly as your boy Brady did this year and Roethlisberger can't even beat the Chiefs, Browns or Raiders to make the playoffs...

As far as coaching? Two rookie coaches, so I guess we'll see, won't we? Caldwell started the year going for the jugular, something Dungy NEVER did. But got pussied out in true Dungy style down the stretch.

If you'e gonna beat Manning, you better get insane pressure on him (like the Vikings did last week to Dallas). What's succeeded in the Dungy era has been just keep the game close, watch the Colts coaches gag trying to run out the clock and run back a kick for a score or something. Offense vs. defense is no contest, coz Manning's gonna be better than your defense, and maybe Caldwell's smart enough to let Manning throw with a lead for once.

Freeney was the best pass rushing DE in the AFC this year and put up a sack per game this year and is a dominant pass rusher when healthy. He'll make a helluva lot more impact on this game than Bart Scott.

Blazers

13-3 and blowing out the Saints in the NFC championship qualifies as the worst team to ever make a Super Bowl?

Rex Grossman was the QB and they won likely half of their games because of their special teams.

Here are the stats Porker:

Against KC Chiefs: 1TD 3INT

Against Baltimore: 0TD 2INT

Against NE: 1TD 1INT(returned for TD)

That is absolutely aweful. They won despite him.

Blazers pulls examples out of his ass at his convenience (like usual): Manning was 30/38 in that KC game, a 79% completion rate, sacked once in a game the team dominated and won easily. Hard to call that "absolutely awful" no matter how many picks? Manning's QB rating for the game, 71.9, or higher than Mark Sanchez put up for the season this year...

The Ravens game, yes, bad stats. And the Colts won easily. Look at Flacco's #'s in the playoff game against NE this year. Are you really gonna judge a qb's 'playoff worthiness' on stats in games his team won easily?

Manning 'absolutely awful' in the New England game?

Next post is how Manning's 400 yards and 3 TD's against San Diego the next year proves how he just SUCKS in the playoffs.

Colts win, but stats aren't godlike: "Manning sucks".

Colts lose, but Manning's stats ARE godlike? "Manning sucks".

Patriots get dominated by Baltimore pop-gun attack, Brady has the worst game of his life: "CHIIIIIRRRRRPPPPP" (the sound of crickets).

Pittsburgh misses the playoffs because they lose down the stretch to KC, the Raiders and Cleveland, the festering shit heap of the NFL, does Blazers comment how Big Ben must SUCK to let THAT happen? Nope, silence.

Blazers, repeat after me: PEYTON MANNING IS MY DADDY!

Lemme see... A rookie QB who can't win a game with his arm vs one of the most effective passers in the history of the game who can at times (a good amount) score at will.

Yes, the Jets have a better D unit statistically, BUT I'll take a D who needs to cram the box/put a LITTLE pressure on vs a slightly better one stats wise spread all over the field.

I'll also take Joseph over Tommy any day. Fact is they don't need to run. Furthermore, I would not take anyone of the Jets O over the Colts. Saturday is da Man. Jets have great protection? Let's see once they fall behind and need to pass how good they are.

Colts 31-17.


Porker, yes Brady sucked ass. Still #3 in the game...

This article pretty much sums up the matchups in the AFC game:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-afcmatchups&prov=ap&type=lgns

DM, Tom Brady is a GREAT QB, as he proved once and for all in his Bombs Away '07 season. I'm not on any psycho vendetta against him, just putting Blazers' Stucking Foopid rants against Manning in context.

1TD and 5INT in the first two rounds is awful no matter how you slice it. They won that year because of their D and their running game. Don't think Manning has a reputation for choking during big games...google it.

I merely pointed out how poorly Manning played during their Super Bowl season and he has obviously only been there once after being the #1 seed 5 fucking times without going to the big game. That rests with the QB.

Unfortunately, you failed to mention that Ben had the best season of his career with the worst offensive line in the NFL. He was asked to go to his second Pro Bowl as the first alternate but has a shoulder problem and can't make it. Roethlisberger was the second highest rated QB in the AFC this year.

Again, you are a fantasy guy without a team that you actually support so you side with Manning.

Manning is a great regular season QB. When he gets pressure, he has horrible footwork, doesnt keep his head up and throws picks. Any team with a pass rush has always exposed his weakness'...ie Pittsburgh, San Diego and the Pats.

DM,

No way the Colts score 31 points on the Jets. For the most part, I do agree with much of your assessment of Manning, but the Jets defense has been playing great through the last part of the season and the playoffs. They are not the same team the Pats destroyed mid season. The Jets will run for over 200 yards against the Colts D, they don't need a great passer at QB. And you are simply being silly if you would take Addai over Jones (now how the fuck did the Bears let him go? Oh ya Cedric Benson - great move).

I don't believe the Jets are going to pull it off, but it is not going to be a blowout, I would say 24-17 is far more realistic, and I really won't be that surprised if it is the Jets with the 24.

Here is the Sports Reporter's write up of the game. I am not buying it...their preciction, but I always enjoy reading these.

RECOMMENDED
NY JETS over *INDIANAPOLIS by 1
"They might have a chance to make a move. Their defense is that good.’’ The quote from
Cincinnati Bengals’ quarterback Carson Palmer regarding the Jersey B Teamers, after the
Jets beat his team in the opening round of this post-season, was pulled and highlighted here
in last week’s issue for your benefit. Oh, geez, it is indeed the Jets, isn’t it? Do you know
what this means? It means that all along, the NFL has really sunk and stunk. There are no
excellent teams. The Colts won 14 straight games, but a lot of them were by slim margins.
They only beat the 49ers by 4 points and the 49ers are just a power-rushing offense with a
really lousy quarterback and a decent def…wait a minute. That’s what the Jets are, except
they have a very good defense, as everybody knows.
How good is it? Good enough to have held opponents to only 3.8 rushing yards per carry and
the lowest Yards Per Attempt passing in the NFL: 5.4. The Jets’ opposing QB Rating of 58.8
is in a range that the Tampa Bay Bucs’ defense was in the year they won the Super Bowl
against the Raiders. The Jets faced enough decent quarterbacks that you’re not inclined to
say, ‘Well, that rating is because they played against a bunch of bums, and Peyton Manning
is not a bum.’ Matt Schaub got nothing done against the Jets and he led the NFL in passing
yardage. Tom Brady and the Pats didn’t get into the end zone against them in Week 2. The
Jets held Drew Brees and the Saints to nearly two TDs below their season scoring average,
and “only” 343 yards from scrimmage. In fact, New Orleans scored only 13 offensive points
against the Jets (and 14 defensive points off a 99-yard INT return and an end zone fumble
recovery off the awful rookie Jets’ quarterback, whose presence they can withstand and still
win). Later on, Atlanta’s Matt Ryan, a pretty good quarterback on a pretty productive Atlanta
offense, was shut down for most of the game in a 10-7 Jets’ loss. Cincinnati’s Carson Palmer
looked like a rookie two weeks in a row against it. Finally, the Jets completely rattled the
cage of San Diego quarterback Philip Rivers. They made Rivers look like Brett Favre on a bad
day, flinging it and just hoping somebody would catch it!
The Colts are getting kudos for having shut down the Baltimore running game last Saturday
night. But who ever said that Baltimore was an excellent running team? They like to run.
They prefer to run, because Joe Flacco and the receivers don’t set the world on fire against
the best of the NFL’s all-lousy teams. But the Ravens rushed for 35 fewer yards per game
than the Jets rushed for this season, on 139 fewer carries overall. The Jets ran it 607 times
and are starting to look like the Steelers team that beat the Colts in the 2005 AFC Divisional
Round with 35 minutes of possession time yet only 295 yards from scrimmage and –2 in
turnovers. It’s a 3-4 defense that can frustrate Manning and force the Colts’ offense into taking
penalties trying to protect him. “Manning was wildly missing his first four passes and
feeling pressure from everywhere,” said the game recap. See? The guy isn’t Superman.
Somewhere along the line, the wrong match-up materializes. The Colts have been a good
pass offense with a good pass defense. They have usually been the better pass offense and
the better pass defense. But now, Indy is a good pass offense against a good pass defense,
and a good pass defense against a good rushing offense. The strengths of both Colts’ units
are matched unfavorably, the Jets probably have the better kick return game, yet the Colts
are favored by a touchdown.
The Jets, who aren’t supposed to be able to come from behind, have come from behind on
the road against Cincinnati and San Diego already, two decent defenses that did a better job
of stopping the run this season than the Colts did. The Jets’ offensive line is pretty good.
Guards Faneca and Woody have Super Bowl rings, Mangold the center is a back-to-back pro
bowler there are no Pro Bowlers in the middle of Indy’s defensive line. As mentioned in that
Recommended pick on the Jets in Week 16, quarterback Mark Sanchez saw plenty of Cover-
2 in the Pac 10 and the way to beat Cover-2 has always been with blunt force in the rushing
attack, which then allows a merely accurate QB to manage the game. NY JETS, 17-16.

Teddy Bruuuuuuuuuuuuuushi picked the Jets to win outright on ESPN the other night and that boy has plenty of football IQ and knows the personnel of both these teams from field level as well as anybody.

Anyhow, I'm just a fan having a great time with this since it is a once in 2 decades event for the Jets to advance in the playoffs, though I have tried to be objective in my analysis and did pick the Chargers to win last week, but the Jets to cover. And these guys and their coach are just plain lovable and obviously having a great time and feeling zilch pressure - playing with house money and all.

And why are we even talking about Thomas Jones when the name that matters now in the Jets backfield is Shawn Green? How good is this guy going to be when its all said and done?

What I don't feel good about are the psychological traps that Manning sets for the opposition. I think if they are playing anybody but a HOF QB at this particular stage of their development with their confidence through the roof, they come out with Sanchez winging the ball downfield on their first possession. But fearing Colts quick strike capability, the Jets are forced to be conservative and try to eat the clock. It will also be pretty much fascinating to see if the defensive brain trust of the Jets is able to come up with looks that will actually fool Manning - and trying to do so instead of just going with what got them there as the cliche goes, is another potential trap.

The last time the Jets got this far it was also against the Colts with Manning as I remember - about 8 years ago? But two different teams - maybe Manning is the only one left. I was in TJ and watched the game at Caliente with good cash on the line and the Jets won something like 42-0? Somebody help me here. I acknowledge being in advanced stage of Alzheimers. It sent my old libido into a wild spin and I had GFE sessions with 5 different special chicas before I went home at midnight - well, that 5th "session" was with an FOB who I had an instant crush on - she took me into a privado booth and pulled down my trou and boxers and sucked me to an intense climax, number 5 or not - and then started kissing me with her mouth full. Sorry guys! Hey, this is a monger board, right?

Jets by 47!

At this point, I'll let the final score of the game speak for itself.

When he gets pressure, he has horrible footwork, doesnt keep his head up and throws picks. Any team with a pass rush has always exposed his weakness'...ie Pittsburgh, San Diego and the Pats.

Last time "Manning Happy Feet Choke" happened was the last time he played the Pats on the road in the playoffs. Ancient history, and never gonna happen again.

Sampson picking the LCD of pregame analysis. They got bored against the 49'ers and Manning was mildly annoyed with the sun in his eyes in the 1st half. The 3-4 thing was years past, why not dredge up the history of the Colts vs. the Ravens/Ryan instead?

Jets don't get pressure from the front 4, which means they're roadkill. Vikings DO, which might make for an interesting Stupor Bowl.

Should be a great NFC game manana.

Erip, Shonn Greene (not his overrated baseball namesake) is a lumbering Bettis wannabe (with 3 games worth of quality work vs. 13 seasons worth) who makes poor tackling teams look silly. If there's one thing the Colts do well on D, it's tackle.

Teddy Bruschi is the reason you're all giddy about the J-e-t-s? Talk about a clown who rode Brady and Crennel to NFL relevance...

Jeez...

"best season of his career" is being sacked repeatedly for a 9-7 team? Who's a slave to fantasy stats when apologizing for THAT now?

I'll take the home teams and lay the points on both games this weekend.

Garcon, Collie 18 for 274 and counting... Manning shredding the "1 one pass D, overall D, scoring D in the NFL" with, literally, "GUYS OFF THE STREET".

Sampson, nice call on that 3-4 stuff...

"No way the Colts score 31 points on the Jets. For the most part, I do agree with much of your assessment of Manning, but the Jets defense has been playing great through the last part of the season and the playoffs. They are not the same team the Pats destroyed mid season. The Jets will run for over 200 yards against the Colts D, they don't need a great passer at QB. And you are simply being silly if you would take Addai over Jones"

That is worth repeating...


Final score = DM Correct on all points. When are all u armchair analysts going to learn? I do provide free lessons. Thomas Jones really tore it up at least *cough* He should watch Addai's film in the off season to learn how to find a hole.



Now, go Saints!!

I'm picking NO, but this could easily go either way depending on what team shows up. At least the pretenders are out and we're down to 3 quality teams.

(Message edited by donmarco on January 24, 2010)

Porker, btw it's amazing Happy Feet Manning looked like a damn surgeon for much of the game against the vaunted Jet's D eh? When will they learn and stop repeating (and selecting) rubbish stats that suit their purposes?

I'm the biggest Pats/Brady fan in the world, but Tom will never be as good as Peyton. Period.

Manning got lucky, DM. His rookie WR's carried him.

Jets needed a couple of big plays just to score. Colts got no cheap points at all. I believe the story was the Colts defense...maybe they felt disrespected with all the talk of the Jets defense.

BTW....sweating this out when the Colts nearly made that 3rd and 8 deep in the Jet's territory, I could not figure out why they didn't take advantage of the Jet's subs and forced a 12 men on the field penalty.

They did it earlier, creating a free play that would have at worst given them a first and goal and possibly a TD. Anyway the got away with it....but the Colts don't miss too many opportunities like that.

Manning did not get lucky, he's METHODICAL AND GETS THE JOB DONE!!

Tough one to swallow for any Vike fans out there, but the Saints scraped by as I imagined.

While Indy is playing a bit better all around, I'm routing for the Saints in the SB.

DM,

Not sure if you saw the score, but as far as I can tell the Colts did not score 31 points . After the 1st quarter, Jets really could not do much up front to disrupt the Colts. Sanchez had an excellent game, but the Jets scoring on big pass plays is not want they needed to do to win.

I will still contend, if I have a team that needs a 300 carries back and doesn't have one of the best QBs in history on the team, I'll still take Jones over Addai, but the Colts shut down the Jets running game today.

I'm not so sure they didn't get 31...I would have liked the Colts to throw a challenge flag instead of running to the line for a QB sneak and settling for a FG.

KN,

1. Sanchez played about as good as one could hope, but not nearly good enough to "win" the game for the Jets. Once they were behind, they were never a threat. As predicted.

2. The Jet's D couldn't hold up when spread over the field. Manning opened up Addai to gain yards when they needs to control time/possession with ease. As Predicted.

3. The Colts D, not fearing the pass, easily stuffed the run game of the Jets. As predicted.

4. Manning will be on his game. He was. As predicted.

5. Jet's score 17. Lucky to score that, but spot on. As predicted.

6. Colts score 31. Well personally calling them scoring 30 is better than any other analyst prediction out there that I know of. If you have someone on the record calling the game 30-17, let me know. Samson is correct that it was a TD, but the final score is all that matters. As close to one can get to the bullseye.

I don't like the Jets, but I like them a LITTLE more after the last game. Ryan showed some class finally and they played up to potential, etc. Overall nothing to gripe about if one is a Jets fan.

On a side note, what ever happened the screen passes? Both the colts and saints used to live on them, but I rarely saw them...

The other game was a turn over mess....not exactly the type of game you want to see to qualify for the Super Bowl. I believe the Jets had one turn over and that was in the final minutes with the game decided and Sanchez running the two minute warning.

I'm still waiting to see if Blazers will finally bow down to the altar Porker has created for Manning and admit he's a great QB (Manning that is NOT Porker.)

EA

Blazers too busy searching for Peyton Manning Conspiracy Theory websites where they can all congratulate each other for knowing the dark hidden truth: That deep down, despite the gaudy stats and unprecedented team success (no team ever won more games in a decade), that Manning once choked in a playoff game several years back.

DM,

Seems maybe you are attributing others comments to me I don't really don’t think your comments to be very counter to what I have said.

1. My comment was that Sanchez played an excellent game, but that winning in the air was not how the Jets were going to win the game, which seems pretty much exact to your point.

2. I have basically said in every comment that it is because of Manning that Addai was able (and has always been able) to run. I simply point out that if I had to take a running back to use on a running team, I would take Jones over Addai, and nothing has changed that view. My opinion may be driven by having really liked him on the Bears, over the past 5 years or so has been a very successful 300 carry back.

3. I did believe the Jets would be able to run on the Colts, and the Colts were impressive in that regard. Even though the Colts where not playing 100% in their last meeting the Jets ran all over them I expected this game would be similar. I will be the first to admit the Colts defense stepped up more than I thought they would.

4. I never made any comment about if Manning would be on his game (I believe others criticized his playoff performances, I was not one who had). Actually always predicted the Colts would win. My strongest statement ever being I would not be surprised if the Jets win.

5. I would disagree that the Jets were lucky to score 17. They scored because Indy was so focused on the run it left them open to the big pass plays. You also point out that the Colts stuffed the Jets because all they did was focus run, so we are really not that far off here.

6. I would hope you recognize I was only mocking myself with my comment that the Colts did not score 31 point (hence the wink)

I am not a Jets fan, in fact have actually always liked Manning and the Colts. I would have liked to see the Jets win simply for the upset. Basically, I thought the Colts did not look that good in the first game, and seemed like the Jets particularly on D were flying high. I thought that gave the Jets a really good shot at winning.

In the end I am pretty happy to see a NO vs. Indy Super Bowl; rarely do the two teams that were number one in each division end up in the matchup. I really don’t know who I think will win. If I had to bet, I would take the Colts. Would rather see the Saints win, though, and will be pulling for them. Have always liked Manning, but Brees is one of my favorites, mainly because he is a Big Ten QB and I am a Big Ten fan (went to U of I) and like Purdue because my folks went there.

KN,

I provided my commentary on the topics at large, some of which you alluded to (some not)-- my intention was not to insinuate you disputed the facts I set forth.

Peace.

Manning was extremely impressive. If he wins another SB, you can definately place him in the top 10 QB's of all time, maybe top 5.

One thing about Manning was evident in the Jets game. Put pressure on him and he is ok and at times bad. When he gets time to throw the ball, he is as good as it gets. Maybe the most intelligent QB ever.

No matter how his career pans out, one thing is for sure.....he has poor footwork for such an outstanding QB, especially when he gets pressure. The guy is only good in the pocket. Luckily for him, he almost never gets touched. Very likely the most protected QB in the last decade. Their O-line is constantly loaded with Pro Bowlers.

Blazers, Putting pressure and hitting the QB is a formula for making any great QBs look average. Brady is a prime example. Yes, he's a pocket passer, but so aren't 5/5 best all time QBs IMHO-- I don't hold that against anyone.

In terms of him not getting touched, yes he has a consistently good line, but lets not discount play calling and his ability to nail the game plan and get the ball off in a hurry/on target.

Blazers is right, Manning doesn't perform nearly as well when getting hit regularly and can be bothered by rushers breaking free when he's about to throw the ball. But as DM says, it's not just the Colts O-line, it's Manning changing protection schemes to pick up the blitz and getting rid of the ball amazingly quickly (which I believe often involves footwork?) to keep from putting himself in danger. His reputation is such that several NFL coaches and ex-coaches/announcers have claim that it's "stupid" to blitz Manning. I don't know of any other QB in league history with that kind of reputation.

Avoiding sacks is a HUGE component of an offense's success, and Manning is a GOD at doing this. IF you could tell me that the Saints would be hitting Manning half as much as they hit Favre last week, I would pick them to win the game. And they JUST MIGHT. But the Colts history shows that they will figure out how to handle blitz pressure and make them pay for it.

A lot of the reason why he is good against outside blitzes is because he has a quick release, much like Marino. If you create pressure inside and force him to go lateral, that is when he is just aweful.

Of the top QB's now, I would say that Roethlisberger is actually better outside of the pocket but a lot of that isn't by choice as they have had the worst set of offensive tackles for about 4 years now.

As for all time greats, Elway was as good outside hte pocket as inside the pocket and it is why I consider him the best ever...that and 5 SB appearances...3 with teams that had nobody else..NOFUCKINGBODY except him. Well, maybe Steve Atwater on D.

Blazers you seem to forget a fantastic Broncos front line and a Mr. Davis hitting on all cylinders. I also wouldn't call hot rod and shannon sharpe slouches in their prime either.

On D-- they were rating around the top 5, thus very serviceable.

Top 5-
Marino, Elway, Manning, Brady, Bradshaw. Stabler gets my honorable mention.

So, who you guys liking in the Pro Bowl?

Blazers, furthermore on Elway, he was a hell of a lot more effective as he matured and sat in the pocket more.

Elway was a clown compared to Manning and the others on all time lists. The AFC at the time was a super bowl joke. One of the best bets EVER was getting the NFC -7.5 in the Super Bowl before the season began for the better part of a decade and a half.

I'm surprised for no love for Favre. Dude holds serious records, made it to the big 1 2x, took more hits than half the top list combined in their careers. Several NFL types have justified his ranking as the greatest ever that "Favre got HIT". And rubbed some dirt on it and went back out to battle into overtime before throwing in his team's collective towel on an unconscionable pick (like Philip Rivers did this year too).

Erip, now that you mention it, McNabb, Romo, Rodgers vs. Garrard, VY, ??? is one of the greatest position mismatches in the history of all star games?

And since the NFL KNOWS THAT, bet the AFC??? :D

Don Marco...you didn't read my post correctly. The first 3 Super Bowls were him and only him. He did finally win a SB when he did get Davis, Smith, etc. to help him out on offense and they had a decent defense. They also had a stellar offensive line known for chop blocking, giving him plenty of time.

Elway was not a clown compared to Manning and the AFC is a joke now in comparison. The teams winning the AFC over the last 5 years has not been truly great teams, including Pitt's teams.

Elway was not a clown compared to Manning and the AFC is a joke now in comparison.

Yeah, those Elway-Dave Krieg matchups with the division on the line were EPIC!

And don't forget the heroic battles with Buffalo to be the NFC's Super Bowl bitch...

When the immortal Doug Williams rips you a new ass in the Super Bowl, your team officialy sucks!

Porker, while we're pretty close on many matters, calling Elway a clown in reference to anyone is bordering on absurd. Yes, I don't give Favre the nod out of personal bias. The guy singlehandedly lost at least as many big games as he won (i.e. 1 and out).

Blazers, I was looking at when he actually pulled it all together, not when he lost the big one. If we're going to count losers, then Jimbo from Buff is right up there too...

Porker, Elway a clown, right. 20+ years later and 'The Drive' still lives in football lore. Elway's receivers as a group throughout his career don't compare to the guys Manning has thrown to and he is still top 5 in yards, tds, and comps. And as Blazers points out 5 SBs and 2 rings.

I do actually think Manning is on his way to being the best ever, but for that to happen he'll need to fill up a few more fingers with rings. If he continues at this level for another 5 more years hard to think of what record he won't hold (well probably not ints thrown).

I am, for certain obvious reasons, a Favre hater. But cmon the guy owns every record for a QB, and never missing a game is damn impressive. I don't know how you cannot consider him one of the best ever. But Porker I have a hard time seeing how getting hit is a criteria, when it caused him to then rush throws causing those big interceptions. Maybe if he was willing to sit down like Manning is, he might not hold that int record along with the rest.

Hoo dat gonna beat dos Saints? Obviously, not the Indianapolis Peytons!

congrats to the Saint's-- they were blessed with gifts this postseason.

Saints played very well on offense and deserved to win. Colts coaching even more conservative and boneheaded than with Dungy (I didn't think that was possible) sitting on the ball at the end of the first half playing scared, trying a 51 yard FG in the 4th quarter wit a 50 year old kicker...

Manning plays a good (and often brilliant) game within the conservative game plan, then gets hung out to dry when Reggie Wayne sells out and doesn't come back for the ball.

That's bullshit. Manning underthrew that ball yet Steve Young bails him out in the post game interview by saying it was the receivers fault. Of course, all QB's stick together.

Manning chokes....again.

I felt sorry for Manning and was shocked by the overall team ineptness of the Colts under pressure in the 4th quarter. They stunk through and through and Manning stunk - really just didn't seem to have it late in the game though they hit a few decent plays. But they could only bend a not so great Saints defense. Couldn't believe they couldn't score on that last post-interception drive when they were 1st and goal at the 4 after a penalty. I am sure the Saints defense had plenty to do with it - they no doubt played their best game of the season and they did not let Colts backs and receivers make plays in the open field - they tackled!

The interception was a horrible play by Manning - looking at Wayne the whole time like a rookie, and throwing a pass that just didn't need to be thrown. It was a 4 down situation and they needed only 5 yards. Perhaps Wayne could have bailed him out, but that doesn't mean it wasn't a really bad play. Sadly as one broadcaster stated, Manning will be the one to wear this loss, and unless he gets another shot or two to win Supe, he will be as haunted by that play for his whole life as Favre will be by his bonehead throw 2 weeks ago. Talk about destiny - the Saints survive with two HOF QBs making the worse plays they can make when it counts the most. Post sainthood miracles.

Manning didn't get it done on the last drive, that's true. He's also not even close to the reason his team lost the game.

"Talk about destiny - the Saints survive with two HOF QBs making the worse plays they can make when it counts the most. Post sainthood miracles"



Exactly how I feel. While Manning's toss wasn't anywhere near as bad as Favre's, it proved just as costly. That is not a play I would expect from one of the all-time best QBs in their prime. In fact, he's behind Brady and Bradshaw on my list now.

It's time to face the facts guys, Manning has chocked to many times now in the postseason.

He's 9-9 in th postseason and in his 9 losses his offense has averaged 14 pts.

His 17 points scored in this SB would be good for 0 SB wins in the 32 years of the passing era.

The 10 point lead the Colts surrended is the largest in history, and from that point, in 3 quarters of football, Manning could only produce 7 points.

Yea, it's time to acknowledge the truth about Manning, he's a regular season wonder and a postseason failure.

I don't know how you can blame Manning. He passed for 16 1st downs, over 300+ yds, had a 96-yard drive and threw some really accurate passes (that one down the right-hash to Clark was pretty amazing). I don't think you need a great coach, because Manning is great at reading defenses and calling audibles.

The Saints had 2 big plays (the on-side kick and the interception) and the Colts just didn't have one. That was the game.

That 50-yd FG in perfect conditions and a perfect hold should not have been missed....but Stover shanked it. Garcon dropped a couple of very catchable balls. The Colts gave up a few key penalties as well. All of this was momentum-changers. None of this was Manning's fault. The Saints did a good job in the 2nd half of just keeping the Colts' offense off the field.

Just my opinion, but I think the Colts are the better team. If they played another quarter, I think they would have came back to win it. Like I said, NO - 2 big plays: IND: - 0 big plays. That was it.

On the flip-side, Drew Brees seems to be a super nice guy. I am happy for the city of New Orleans for the win.

I get a kick out of reading all you football "experts" take on the game and why NO won and Manning lost the big game. I'd particularly be interested in seeing some of your own football credentials to back up your wit and wisdom. Especially those of you who pinpoint such things as a professional quarterback's "footwork" as to the reason why they are no good. As someone who played the game into university (though admittedly not very well) I can safely say that I do not have the sort of expertise that would allow me to make such brash conclusions.

Overall, I thought it was a pretty well played game and highly entertaining. There wasn't a lot of big plays that excite the casual fan, but there was a lot of little things done well by both teams. Going into the game, I predicted an Indy victory on the thought that they had the better defense between the two teams. After watching Brees shred that defense with relative ease in the second half, I must withdraw that conclusion. I thought Manning played well, except for that single pass which could have been his fault (a poorly thrown ball) or Wayne's (not running the correct route.) In fact, I thought the Colt's offense was TOO conservative and said so to myself in the middle of the 2nd quarter. I they felt they didn't rely enough on Manning's arm. Since Manning seems to call the majority of the team's plays, he must take the blame for that. Of course, that was probably the offensive strategy going into the contest, so the fault is not entirely his.

All-in-all it was one of the better played Super Bowl contests I have seen in since the 49ers beat the Bengals in 1983. (And remember sports fans, the MVP of that game only threw for a mere 157 yards and a touchdown. My how the game has changed!)

EA

Drew Brees went the entire postseason without throwing "ONE SINGLE INTERCEPTION" that's 3 consecutive games.

Drew Brees Saints trailed for most of the game, when Bree's had to continually bring the Saints back to keep them in the game, in the process he did it every time without throwing "ONE SINGLE INT".

Manning when he fell behind for the first time, "AND NOW HAD THE PRESSURE" of bringing his team back, he crashed and burned throwing a pathetically poor pass, while Brees went the "ENTIRE POST SEASON WITHOUT THROWING A SINGLE INT"

If Brees can do it for 3 consecutive games why can't "THE GREATEST OF ALL-TIME DO IT FOR JUST ONE GAME, JUST ONE DRIVE" ????????????????

NO, OF COARSE IT'S NOT MANNING'S FAULT, IT NEVER IS, HE'S THE CHOSEN ONE !!!!!!!!!!!!

WAKE-UP FROM YOUR FAIRY-TALE ESPN WORLD YOU LIVE IN !!

Bottom line is football is a team sport and technically the blame can be spread around...Manning included. But in the public eye, the QB is the high profile player and wins and losses will always weigh heaviest on that position.

IMHO, there were one too many dropped passes and something to be desired in defense (the Freeney injury did hurt the Colts in the end), special teams and even coaching...but the pick 6 INT was on Manning.

Manning is a great QB and when all is said and done, atleast he can stake a claim to being on a SB winning team (unlike other great QBs like Marino or Tarkenton or Kelly)

I gotta give credit to a job well done by the Saints. They had a great game plan and worked together as a team to win...Brees, a great QB, completed passes to 8 different receivers. (The Chargers must be continuing to kick themselves in the butt for letting him go)

This ended up being one of the more entertaining SB to watch

I enjoyed the game although I was hoping for a different outcome. The Colts our rushed, out passed, and out first downed the Saints.

They could have easily won the game. I think there are a few reasons why the Saints got the win.

1) well they scored more points.

2) the end of the first half played to the Saints advantage as if they would have gone for an made a field goal, Indy and Manning would have had two minutes to answer and most likely would have got at least 3 and maybe 7.

3) The recovery of the one-side kick essentially gave the Saints and extra possession and kept Manning and boys on the side lines.

4) Of course the clincher was the int for a TD. I'm sure Manning would like to have that back.

I think Manning will have another opportunity to win a Super Bowl.

The game was very clean with a minimum of penalties and only the one turnover. I sometimes wonder why the on-side kick is not a turn over. IF the ball was kicked 70 yards, muffed and recovered it would have been a turn-over....I don't see the difference.

El apodo, your post is the perfect example of excuse making for Manning.

Instead of acknowlegding the great play of Brees who clearly outplay Manning, you say it must of been the Indy defense that wasn't very good. You just can't bring yourself to say Brees gunned down Manning.

Brees posted a 109 QB Passer rating this season, one of the greatest season in NFL history.
Manning posted a 99 QB passer rating, good but certainly not overly impressive in today's NFL.

Brees had more TD's, fewer INT, a better ave per pass att, a better completion percentage than Manning, Brees outplayed Manning in every passing catagory that has to do with effiency.

Brees set the alltime NFL record for completion percentage this season.

Brees came into the SB with the better game, Manning with the bigger name.

Brees had outplayed Manning all season, and it should not be a surprise to anyone that when the 2 met on SB sunday the QB that played better all season played better in the big game as well.

Brees produced a 114 QB rating in the SB, 5 points above his season ave
Manning, a 88 or 11 points below his season ave.

Some QB's raise their games in the biggest games and some just don't.

And by the way, Manning produced just a 81 in the Colts win over the Bears, again playing way below his regular season ave, beginning to see a trend here.

But according to you, it wasn't Brees the great QB who produced one of the greatest season in NFL history, that played great this day, it must of been the Colts defense, right ?????

I agree with El apodo. One lousy throw is one lousy throw, it's not a career ender. If you had your pick of 32 starting NFL quarterbacks I'm guessing 80% would want Manning. Brees, Brady, Farve would obviously be in the running also. Both teams/quarterbacks played well, a couple of mistakes helped determine the outcome. Just wait until next year, we can all resume this banter again.

You give me a big game and I will take Roethlisberger over Manning any fucking day of the week. Some QB's thrive under defensive pressure and scrutiny and some don't.

El Apodo thinks that this was the most entertaining game in 20 years but I guess he didn't watch last years SB which many consider the best ever when you consider the game was decided in the last seconds of the game, had an amazing defensive touchdown to end the first half and demonstrated the amazing talents of Warner and Fitzgerald.

I definitely don't think this was one of the best Super Bowls. In fact, least year, Pittsburgh/Arizona was a nail biter to the end. But then who can forget New York Vs New England. That catch by David Tyree with the ball on the side of his helmet was a miracle but somehow he hung on.

So then great quarterbacks come up big in big games? I have always thought so and that is why I admire Bradshaw and Montana the most.

Fooledagain,

Why so much hate for Manning? Reread what I wrote, it may have been his fault; it may have been Wayne's. I, for one, do not know. If either of those guys have any class, we will never know. I also wrote that he has to take part of the blame for the play calling. Is it totally his fault? Of course not as this is a team game. Hammering a guy for making one bad throw, is just retarded. (Maybe Beachman can sic Sarah Palin on me for using the R word.)

Face it, Manning is a great quarterback. Is he my all-time favorite? Hell no. But he does things that NO other quarterback in the modern game does. Granted, if I were on that coaching staff, I don't think I'd let him do so much play calling, but I'm not there so it's a mute point.

Brees had an outstanding game. He was Montanaesque in the second half. In the first half, he was good, not great, good. Take nothing away from him, he outplayed Manning during this game.

Blazers you can have Roethlisberger and his concussion-prone noodle. He a good quarterback, probably top 10 in the NFL right now, but not a great quarterback. I do think he a great leader and that means a lot.

Frankly, I'd take my all-time favorite quarterback Kenny Stabler over both Manning or Roethlisberger any day of the week. That guy just knew how to win!

EA

Manning when he fell behind for the first time, "AND NOW HAD THE PRESSURE" of bringing his team back, he crashed and burned

Weren't the Colts behind when he led the TD drive in the 3rd quarter? Hmmm, but that doesn't count, right, because it doesn't fit your rant?

Anyone trying to pin the LOSS on MANNING is truly the one seeing what they want to see.

Blazers, unfortunately Big Ben didn't get to the "big game" this year because he and his defending champs team can't beat Cleveland, KC or the Raiders in fucking November. He was cool under pressure to the tune of getting sacked 5x as often as Manning does. BRILLIANT!

Lancer, yes, Trent Dilfer and Doug Williams should be in the HOF.

(Message edited by copperfieldkid on February 09, 2010)

If Roethlisberger had Manning's offensive line, we would be talking about Ben going to another post season and another Pro Bowl...wait he did get invited again. Ben won a SB with the worst Offensive line any team has brought to a SB.

El Apodo. Ben is not just a great leader, he puts up numbers. The guy threw for 4,400 yards and was SECOND in the AFC in QB rating this year. Most QB's are just good in the pocket OR outside the pocket. Ben is good at both.

Kenny Stabler was a great QB but he had nowhere near the arm strength as Big Ben and ended up with ONE RING on one of the most talented teams the NFL has ever seen. Two HOF offensive lineman, a superior TE in Casper, great receiver in Cliff Branch and solid RB's, including Mark Van Eeghan(sic).

No wonder you don't like the Steelers, they owned the Raiders during the 70's.

Blazers,

You left out Fred Biletnikoff. He made HOF too. Raiders also had a very good defense back in the day.

If... If... If... IF Ben could beat the lowly Raiders OR the lowly Chiefs OR the lowly Browns, he could have had a chance to beat Manning this year. But I guess those games just weren' "big ENOUGH", so they shouldn't count, right Blazers?

BTW, Wasn't every guy on the Colts line a 6th round pick or worse? Saturday's the only one consistently making the Pro Bowl. Roethlisberger takes sacks because he holds the ball too long looking for a highlight film play when the team needs him to be SMART. What good is a fancy QB rating when sacks are killing your offense?

It's comical seeing Blazers use regular season #'s (that Manning puts up EVERY STINKING YEAR) to make his case that a guy that can't beat the RAIDERS, the CHIEFS, the BROWNS had a great season.

But let Manning throw ONE PICK in a Super Bowl, and he's lower than snake shit?

BTW, David Garrard and Vince Young were in the Pro Bowl this year. BIG ACCOMPLISHMENT!

And the Raiders were handed the playoff game win over the Pats when the refs called roughing the QB on Sugar Bear Hamiliton when it clearly without question was not, which kept them alive on the final drive of the game.

el apodo, no hate for Manning, just looking at his postseason play objectively and not with hype in my eyes.

One play doesn't define a player's carear, but for Manning it's been many failures in ther postseason, not just this one play.

Just last season, if you can remember that far back, down by 6 in the 4th quarter, needing just 1 score in the entire quarter, Manning couldn't do it, not a single point, scoring just 17 pts in the game, you won't win many playoff gasmes scoring 17 pts, especially at home, in a dome, on turf with perfect weather conditions to excel in the passing game and Manning can't do it.

In the process, Manning became just the 2cd or 3rd QB in the entire history of the NFL to lose a postseason game to a team with a non winning record, and at home in a dome with perfect weather for the passing game to excel, now, does that sound like stuff legends are made of, the greatest QB of alltime ?????


That one play puts a huge exclamation point on all those past failures, it verifies all those past failures.

Manning and the Colts set the record for most wins in a decade but have little to show in the postseason for all those wins.

1 SB win, 2 SB appearances, 3 Championship game appearances.

The 49ers had the previous record, set in the 80's, in the process they won 4 SB's, had 4 SB appearances, and Montana still today holds the record with 6 Championship game appearances.

The 49ers and Monotana took all those wins and basically doubled what the Colts and Manning did in the Postseason.

Yet Manning's the greatest of alltime, right ???

The excuse for Manning has always been, he doesn't have a defense.

In Mannings 9 playoff losses he produced a ave of just 14 pts per game, does that sound like the defenses fault ??? Y ou won't win many playoff games scoring 14 pts.

Manning has over and over again, not just this 1 SB or 1 play but repeatedly underperformed in the postseason.

When he set the record for best QB Passer rating in history 121 back in 2004, he crashed and burned with a 69 rating in the postseason. In his 2 SB appearances he underfperformed in both, producing a 88, 11 ptd below his season ave, and just a weak 81 in his 1 SB win.

Most people who are uniformed and don't know history will argue, of coarse he's got a lower QB passer rating in the postseason because he's playing better competion, well , good example look at Brees, he step onto the biggest stage and overperformed producing a spectacular 114 or 5 pts better than his already great 109 regular season rating.

Some players elavate their games on the biggest stage and some don't, unfortunatly for Manning, he doesn't.

Montana played 4 SB and did not throw 1 single INT, not even 1. If he can do it for 4 SB's why can't Manning, if he's the greatest of alltime do it for just 1 SB ?????

The fact is, Manning has done nothing in the postseason that would warrant the claim as "greatest QB of alltime".

Fool(edgain)

Who said Manning is the "great QB of all-time?" Certainly not I. Manning is not even the "anointed one" - that would be Tom Brady.

Greatest quarterback of all-time - arguably Joe Montana. He didn't have the greatest skills set (Blazers wouldn't like him because he didn't have a rifle for an arm), but when it comes to winners, no one was better. And if you will remember, early in his career Montana had the "can't win the big game" bear on his shoulders. Manning hasn't proven himself to be in Montana's league. But then again, few have.

BTW, which "uniformed" people are you referring to who do not know their history? Would that be police officers? soldiers? Girl Scouts? Keep spouting your crap, someday you may even believe it yourself. Personally, I'm beginning to think that Manning fucked your girlfriend and you just have it in for him!!

Can't wait for the next round of your obscure, isolated stat sets that don't prove a thing!!

EA

Peyton Manning is the greatest QB that ever played, and second isn't particularly close.

If Peyton is the greatest QB ever then Joe Montana was stuffed liver. It's simple Peyton is the greatest regular season QB and chokes in the post season. I've lost money on the Colts too many times in the post season! Let's not forget also that the one SB that Peyton won was against the Bears (my team), but they had the worst offense in SB history that year.

Yea, that sounds about right Porker, the only evidence you can bring to the table to show Manning is the greatest of alltime is " because you said so", unfortunately that's not evidence.

4 MVP's, 4K yards 30 td's every year, games won in a decade record, the most consistently excellent QB to ever play, never takes sacks, never fumbles, qb rating, blah, blah, blah. There may be a guy or two that could give him the run in 1-2 of any of those categories, nobody can touch him across the board.

But since Bart Starr won 2 Super Bowls, he obviously must have been better, right?

You have to look at how QB's perform post season and regular season. Not one or the other. It's a balance. Manning is a bad QB when you flush him out of the QB...plain and simple. That pick in the SB was Manning panicking and throwing off of his back foot. It is not just what you do but WHEN you do it.

QB's in history who at this point were better QB's than Manning:

John Elway
Joe Montana
Tom Brady
Johnny Unitas
Troy Aikman


I don't count QB's who racked up numbers and titles before 1955. I guess an argument could be made for Otto Graham and Sonny Jergenson as well. An argument could be made that Steve Young is better than Manning as they both have 1 ring as a starter but Young was a more accurate passer and great inside and outside the pocket. He could throw from a ton of different angles as well. Unfortunately he was behind Joe Montana for a couple SB's. Technically he has three rings which is still more than Manning.

What is unbelievable to me is how much credit/blame is given one player in one game in a team sport in a 5 month season. If Manning was putting up regular season #'s on a poor team (Matt Schaub style this year, Brees last year), it'd be one thing, but the guy's team won more games in a decade than any other team ever, and that's with Tom Brady at the helm of the 4 super bowl Patriots at the same time -- not making the Super Bowl in name only like Elway and Kelly did several times because the whole conference was a festering shithole.

Name ONE other player in history where teams in their division devoted their entire draft focus to stop ONE GUY?

Blazers, if Manning's "footwork" is so poor, and he's admittedly immobile, how do you explain your boy Roethlisberger (and all other mortals) propensity to take 10x as many sacks and fumbles? THAT doesn't go into "Passer Rating", and something that makes Manning even more godlike than ever.

Hey Porker, Manning may be god like in the regular season, but he has feet of clay in the post season. Say what you want, but I'd not put my money on him in a championship or SB game. On the other hand in his day I'd put my money on Montana or Brady and be rewarded.

Or Eli or Dilfer or Doug Williams, Brad Johnson, et al... Betting on random events with small sample sizes is rather stupid, isn't it?

Yea Manning has been spectacular in the regular season, one of the best ever without question.

Are you more impressed by a guy throwing for 450 yards and 6 TD's against the Lions in a regular season game, or a QB who goes 3 consecutive games on the biggest stage, in the most meaningful games, with more pressure without throwing a single INT, when if he had throw just 1 INT in the Vikings game or Colts game would of likely meant defeat, the key is he did not. He rose to the occasion and siezed the moment. Manning did not

To be the greatest of alltime you've got to do it on the biggest stage with all the pressure, as well as the regular season.

Bart Starr produced the best QB Passer rating in NFL postseason history 104.8.

When QB's pass the ball well their teams win, and not surprisingly Starr produced the best record in postseason history 10-1.

2 SB championships and 3 NFL Titles before the SB was invented.

When the QB Passes the ball well his team wins.

Have any idea who's 2cd on the list, if you said Drew Brees you'd be right.

Brees elavated his game in the postseason and now has the 2cd best QB Passer rating in NFL history, 103.7.

And has 6th best win/loss percentage in postseason history.

When a QB passes the ball well his team wins.

Brees passed the ball better than Manning in the postseason and not surprisingly has a better record than Manning in the postseason, and not surprisingly outplayed Manning when the 2 met in the SB.

Manning has a 87.6 QB Passer rating in the postseason, almost 8 points below his regular season average, and not surprisingly has a worse postseason record than regular season record.

When the QB passes the ball well his team wins.

Manning has a 85.4 rating in the SB, 10 points below his regular season rating, the bigger the game the more Manning has underperformed.

THE GREATEST OF ALLTIME WOULD ELAVATE HIS GAME IN THE BIGGEST GAMES.

And Starr performed much better than Manning playing outdoors in brutal weather and in a era when defensive players could maul the QB and recievers.

Manning plays indoors on turf with perfect weather conditions in a era that's the easy by far for QB's to pass the ball when all the rules favor the QB and offense and Manning repeated has underperformed in the postseason in the most ideal conditions a QB could ever ask for.

There's no way he can be the best alltime, it just ain't so !!!

When a QB passes the ball well his team wins.

Manning has the 4th best regular season QB Passer rating in history in the regular season and not surprisingly has a great regular season record , including most wins in a decade.

The 49ers owned the previous record set in the 80's, and not surprisingly Montana finished the 80's with the best QB Passer rating in history.

Do you see the correlation between passing the ball well and winning games ?????????

When Manning passed the ball well inthe regular season his teams won at a record pace.

When Manning passed the ball well below his regular season ave in the postseason the teams record was also well below it's regular season ave.

You might want to go read what Williams, the defensive cordinator of the Saints said about the 2cd half of the SB, WHEN HE MADE ADJUSTMENTS AT HALFTIME THAT COMPLETELY BAFFLED MANNING IN THE 2CD HALF and one of the reasons they scored just 7 pts in the 2cd half.


One of the biggest excuses people have made for Manning's postseason failures through the years has been his defense is weak.

Facts are, the defense produced an impressive goal line stand at the end of the 1st half, and held the no.1 offense in the league and one of the greatest offenses of alltime, one of the few offenses in history to score over 500 pts in a season out of the endzone and with 0 pts.

Then it was Manning's turn, the greatest of alltime, calling his own plays was afraid to pass the ball so he runs 3 and out and gives the ball back to the Saints in ideal field position and basically it was Manning who handed the Saints 3 pts before half.

But his defense failed, right ??

Manning's offense produced just 17 pts against the 3rd worst scoring defense to win a SB.

The Saints defense gave up a whooping 341 pts this season.

When Manning won his only SB, his QB Passer rating was a very weak 81.8, he underperformed once again.

But fortunately for Manning the QB on the opposing team was Rex Grossman, owner of a 70.2 lifetime QB Passer rating.

And Rex, as could be expected, performed poorly, producing just a 68.3 QB Passer rating in the SB, and Manning with his underperforming day walk away SB Champ.

When Manning had a better QB on the opposing team, not surprisingly the better QB performed better and won the game.


Don't see how anyone can "OBJECTIVELY" look at "THE FACTS" and call Manning "THE GREATEST OF ALLTIME".

IT JUST AIN'T SO !!!!

Calling anyone the greatest of all time is foolhardy. I think one can safely proclaim an elite few that are in that conversation. Regarding ones's SB rating as a determinate, that's not top of my list personally. I would take Marino over Brady and Manning and the guy never won a superbowl. It's the body of work. The NFL is extremely competitive team to team these days with a couple exceptions and anyone posting up huge #s over the course of a career weighs in more than 1 pick in a post season game.

You think MANNING was given the liberty to pass the ball at the end of the first half but chose not to? Yeah, like he cheerfully took himself out of the game in week 15 with a perfect season in the palm of his hand... Dude follows orders when they give him some. Even when they come from ridiculously inept "strategists" like Dungy and Caldwell.

Manning has put up EXCELLENT numbers in the last 5 years in the playoffs and led several comeback victories in the process, including in the Super Bowl. His team is a factor in the playoff picture EVERY year. He will own every record in the history of the sport the minute Favre stays retired.

But that he only has ONE Super Bowl MVP trophy to this point in his career enrages the peanut gallery to such a degree? Again, the last time Peyton Manning could be blamed for "losing" a playoff game was the last time they lost at the Patriots (in the conference title game). The man has done a helluva lot of winning.

Good points Pork. With that said, Manning is going to have to shut up his detractors and put a nail in the coffin of a team or two in upcoming Superbowls. Sadly, if they had won that last one, the peanut gallery would have little to grasp on to. That's reality.

DM, people like the Manning bashers here have a deep-seated resentment of him that will never be overcome, even if he somehow goes on a Bill Russell style title run. They will hold onto their Terry Bradshaw love-fests no matter how stupid it sounds to any rational person. And when they get tired of bashing Manning, then it's time to bash AROD!

BTW, how come the retards here never start "Franco Harris >>> Walter Payton" arguments when this "how many super bowls did you win" crap starts? I guess only QB's get held accountable...

(Message edited by porker on February 14, 2010)

Or Roger Craig > Barry Sanders...

Didn't the Colts have a running back named Edgerrin James that gained over 9,000 yards when he was with the Colts. He made things pretty easy for Manning with the play action fakes and keeping a defense honest while giving Manning time to throw.


To say Manning has never had a supporting cast and he by himself made the Colts the winnest team in the decade is so insane.

Porker has a hard-on for Manning just like he does for Arod. He just can not and will not ever comprend that to be remember as one of the really greats you have to perform just as good or better in the playoffs as you do in the regular season. A .500 record in the playoffs just doesn't cut it.

How many trophy fucks look great in the bar...... but their performance in the bedroom knocks them down a few knotches in their rating. That Manning....looks great in the regular season but just average in the playoffs

Speaking of retards...

Beachman, please respond about the greatness of Walter Payton and Barry Sanders in regards to their playoff "accomplishments".

Another reason you can keep Rothlisberger - off field distractions, again....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100308/ap_on_sp_fo_ne/fbn_roethlisberger_investigation

EA

Add to the "winners" lore that started with Joe Idaho being shipped off to Des Moines to end his career:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-trippinwednesday060210

Meanwhile, Manning gonna sign a 100 Mill. extension...

HE SUCKS.

BTW, not to pile on, but where does Jeter sign next year if he doesn't wanna take a massive pay cut?

THE ROYALS? Pretty much the only team in baseball dumb enough to pay him to not produce into his rocking chair years?

I bet 100 of fooledagain1's units on Tennessee - 6 1/2 over the Raiders starting a 6-8 true rookie POSITION SHIFTED Center who missed half the pre-season with injuries.

With J. Campbell the new QB and the always crappy Raider O/Run D, this one SHOULD BE ugly!

It's a beautiful thing...Titans 38, Raiders 6 at the beginning of the 4th after Campbell throws it to a Titan and it is returned to the 1. I guess the Raider hype still survives even after the record breaking commitment to minimum 11 loss seasons. Ok, they get a merely mediocre QB to replace the worst starting QB in NFL history. I suppose that's an improvement.

How this game was only -6.5 for the Titans playing at home I do not get. That means if they were playing on a neutral field, Titans would only be favored by 3 to 3.5. Titans were almost flawless in the 2nd half last season and almost made the playoffs following the disastrous start. They have the best RB, a great defense, and I believe one of the best 5 coaches in the league.

It was a slam dunk, but good wagerin' Porker!

I see I taught you well Poker, carry on grasshopper.

Shocking that the Steelers are only laying 3 points at Miami. Vegas must know something here.

Refs sure tried their damndest at the end of the game to make sure the Steelers won...

I HATE ZEBRAS!

Vegas knows everything.

The call was right but the reasoning was wrong. When a Ref calls a touchdown on the field, the play is dead. Most of th players on offense are not even going to go after the ball a the play is OVER. Ben has his hand on the ball an you can see the ref tapping him on the back and Ben stated that he reminde him that it's a touchdown. It's one of those rare plays that ties the hands o the ref.

Re: refs "hands being tied", if that's the rule that a TD means PLAY OVER, that's pure idiocy. NFL refs have quit on plays for YEARS with ridiculous excuses like "inadvertent" whistles... If the ball's on the ground and those out of control zebras are saying anything BUT DIVE ON THAT FUCKER, they should ALL be SHOT.

Let the play play out and sort everything ELSE out later.

BTW, Favre's shitty spell yesterday came while playing on a broken ankle. And if the zebra on the FIELD had his say, the Vikes won the game on Harvin's TD in the last minute (He was actually 1 foot out of bounds on his second foot). If the old forceout rule was in effect, it was a miraculous Favre comeback yet again...

NFl to vikes (per nfl network):

"Shiancoe play was a TD. OOPS!".

So how big is the fine they lay on Chilly the Child Molester for his comment about the shitty refs? Gotta LOL at his comment about "50/50 drunks in a bar would call it a TD".

Not the rule, the play could have gone Miami's way but there was not definitive evidence Miami recovered the fumble.

Players today are taught to go after the ball "even after the play is over" because on fumble's it can be reversed by replay, however, there must be a definitive evidence as who recovered the ball and in this case the ref said he did not see that.

The reason they can't just let it playout is because the play called on the field stands if not enough evidence to overturn it by replay, so a call must be made on the field.

If the ref thought it was a TD then he must call a TD, that becomes the play called on the field, you can't just sort out the result later with replay because there may not be enough evidence to sort out what happened.

I'm sorry, if the ball's on the ground and a play is somehow "dead" because some random zebra makes A call, saying PLAY IS OVER for ANY REASON is beyond fucking idiocy? LET THE PLAY PLAY OUT AND SORT IT OUT LATER!!!

If there are stupid rules here to trump that, they should be changed tout de suit (NFL picks their battles in that regard, screw the guys that injure people with LEGAL hits, then the next week, tell them 'uhhh, those hits werent legal...), and then, MAYBE the, NFL refs wouldn't be such a joke as they're looking like today?

Meanwhile, in the big picture, why does anyone invest anything emotionally or financially in who actually wins thanks to the good graces of the zebras?

Do you REALLY want to CARE about such random events?

Leading with the helmet has NEVER been a legal hit - even back in the stone ages when I played. All these guys bitching about taking away the "violent" nature of the game are simply not using the fundamentals that they were taught in high school. These type of tackles are their pathetic attempt to get on highlight reels on ESPN.

Today's player is so big and strong that there is NO need to lead with the helmet. Regular tackling (head across the body, wrapping up with the arms, driving through with the hips) will provide plenty of violence if done correctly - particularly at the speed at which these guys play.

I, for one, applaud the NFL for trying to prevent injuries. I just wish they had started at the BEGINNING of the season rather than mid-way through. That's chicken-shit in my book.

EA

I like Ditka's assessment. Take away the helmets strap on a little leather brain bucket and see which professional athlete leads with their heads/helmet.

His point being that technology allows these guys to make that hit knowing they won't get injured by going head first.

The play did play out and the refs reversed the TD call, but replay did not have conclusive evidence who recovered the ball, therefore Pitt is rewarded the ball at the spot of the fumble.

The play was not dead.

They did exactly what you say, they let it playout then sorted it on by replay, unfortunate for Miami the replay did not show which team recovered the ball.

Those type plays are few and far between, the majority of games the better teams win regardless of the refs calls.

Wrong again fooledagain...whistle blows, plays dead and mos players not even involved in the play...even Ben pulled back after having his hand on the ball whenthe refs yelled touchdown.

Not wrong, if the whistle killed the play why did the Steelers kick a FG after a TD was called ??

Because replay reversed the TD and the refs said the no conclusive evidence on who recovered the fumble therefore the Steelers get possession at the point of the fumble. This happens from time to time.

Where have you been, this has been talked about all over TV land, the latest by Phil Simms on Inside the NFL where Simms said it was the correct call based on the rule and he also said as I did above that the whistle does not kill the play on fumbles, this rule was changed a few years back and that's why players are taught to always go after every loose ball because fumbles can be overturned by replay.

Colts a 3 point dog at Philly? Manning has traditionally destroyed NFC teams who are dumb enough to try and trade scores with him. This piggybacking on the usual relative strengths of the conferences. Basically, the team of 2000's vs. aan average NFC also-ran-in-the-playoffs. NO WAY should Philly be favored here.

Giants D against a 1st time starter Qb (and a total loser of one, at that) in Whitehurst looks like a gimme road blowout too.

Refs give retroactive DO OVER "shoulda been a" 1st down after a holding penalty called on the Chiefs on 4th and "goal"...

Tennessee should kill sucky jacksonville with an all-time sucky opening day QB in L. McCown. Tennessee bet up to -1 after starting at +1.5.

or not!

Weird, weird week in the nfl

LOL...Jack was bet down from -3 to +1.5....One of my friend bets parlays and I gave him 3 winners...one of them being Jack...he played it off of a frickin' card and lost because they had -2.5...I got +1.5 with them today.

Not a weird week at all, Brady looked like the stud he is !

Ravens time honored offensive game plan:

"We'll show up in uniform" looks to have them buried against mighty Jacksonville.

Pathetic!

Vikings favored? W/o Purple Jesus? WTF?

Dallas only -4?

LOL

I bet both Minnesota loss
and Arizona win

what u got, tom brady?

blast from the past: Lastly, who would you pick to coach your team in a big game...I am guessing you are intelligent enough to admit that Ryan is a much better coach.

eso, Tom!!!

#1 pick?

Clowney, Watt, Cushing = Defense wins campeonatos?

Johnny Football goes 1-1 v. Bama wins campeonatos? (Namath meets Tebow, who WINS???)

Teddy Bridgewater wins campeonatos?

Matt Barkley, 2nd day pick (suck for Leinart/Barkley is an underdog to win campeonatos)

Browns/Jags drooling over Manziel? Bridgewater a lock at #1? Clowney needs to watch North Dallas 40/On any given Sunday?