I just came back from 5 awesome days in CR May 21 - 26. Met up with a total heart-throb down there, and she rocked my world. Evidently I rocked hers as well.

Here's the story. At the end of our 4 days together, she doesn't want my money, she stays with me the last day when I told her she was free to go, and now we can't stop thinking about each other. She has Instant Message and email, and we talk everyday. After meeting me, she wants out of the business, she said she can't focus on her other customers now.

Now, let me tell you, she's 21 years old, no kids, a Nica, couldn't be more than 85 lbs wet. Total model body, and she is into YOGA with crazy sex positions.

I am 36 but look in my late 20's. In very good shape and pretty good looking. I am married with a 7 year old daughter.

My wife of 11 years and I don't have sex very often anymore. We seem to have lost patience with each other and now we argue more than in our past years combined.

When I came back from CR, I was in bed with my wife for 5 minutes and she turns it off and says I'm not into this. She then starts quizzing me on where I spent $1,500 on this trip. I told her I didn't use my credit card and paid everything cash. Afterall I was fishing on the coast for 3 days. She doesn't know about the $500 I saved up and brought on the sly for the lady who didn't want it that is now hidden at my office.

After my wife shuts it down, she asks me if I love her as much now as I did 11 years ago. I told her I couldn't compare the levels of love between that distance of time.

Well I have been thinking about this question all week and last night I told her that I feel something is missing in our marriage. I asked her if she felt the same way and she said no. I told her what I was missing, intimacy, to much arguing, the control she exerts. She cried a lot, and I haven't shed a tear.

The Nica wants me to come back and visit her. She has not asked for a penny. In fact, she says she is trying to apply for nursing school so she can stop hooking. She told me she can't do it anymore, she thinks of me.

So guys, I have a wife that plays head games with me. I asked her today if she would go to counseling to try and solve the problems and she told me she was happy and they were my problems to solve. I could go alone. 1 hour later she hugs me and tells me she loves me.

I have a girl I have known for 5 days that only wants to spend time with me and no money requests. Who I would love to help out.

Money is not the issue in my marriage. All cars are paid for, my daughter's college is paid for an guaranteed. Plenty of cash in the bank.

I'm thinking of a divorce. Then make sure the Nica is on the up and up, protect what assets I have after the divorce, and if things work out bring the Nica up and let her go to American College on me. This is my thinking not hers, she doesn't know of this idea.

How crazy am I?

P.S. My wife is at church right now praying about our relationship. She says it is in God's hands. I wish she'd take some interest in saving the relationship. But before she left for church tonight she told me it was my decision and no matter what I decide she will be fine.

You are dealing with two separate issues. 1)Your marriage and whether your relationship is worth trying to salvage, 2) whether you should sponsor a free US college education for a CR hooker that you've know for 5 days.

I'm going to give you my honest opinion because there are plenty of JOEs on this board that are going to blow sunshine up your ass and tell you hookers have feelings too so go with your heart.

If you used the same kind of judgement to pick your wife 11yrs ago I see why you're having problems. Doesn't seem to me that your wife has any real feelings for you, and she probably never did. She is in a classic win win position now. She wins if she stays with you by living the good life, and she wins if you leave her because then she gets to cash out your chips.

You need to make an independant decision on what to do with your relatioship before you worry about who will be the next chica to benefit from your bank account.

As far as your nica chica, she's a hooker and probably says nice things to all the gringos that want to rescue her and let their little heads manage their financial affairs.

If you are such a stud quit patronizing whores in other countries and find yourself a nice hottie at home and bang her for free.

If I had a nickle for every sausage head that thought some hooker was in love with him I would never have to work again.

Nurses earn $350 a month in CR,even less in Nicaragua.The Delrey is full of off-duty nurses trying to supplement their income.A nursing degree and job will not get her out!This doesnt sound like a well thought out plan.

RT:

AtomicCanine is blunt, but correct. Figure out your marriage FIRST, the Tica is fun, but a fantasy. Get counseling -i not as a couple then for yourelf so you can figure out HOW to figure things out...(i.e. a counselor can't give you answers, but he/she can teach you how to ask the right questions). And concentrate on your daughter - just saying that you have her college paid for doesn't absolve you of your responsibilities as a father. She DESERVES your love, no matter what else happens.

Good Luck,

BS

"After my wife shuts it down, she asks me if I love her as much now as I did 11 years ago. I told her I couldn't compare the
levels of love between that distance of time."

BAD ANSWER!:-)!!

I agree with AtomicDog, the chica is just playing you with the straight-up "I need a knight in shining armor" routine. We've all been there to a certain extent so just suppress those thoughts and everything will be fine.

As far as the wife goes, I haven't even thought about a relationship with an American woman since 1995 but from your initial report, it sounds like your in a normal American marraige. My advice? Be discreet and get a girlfriend on the side, preferably one more than a few miles away.

I hear what you all are saying, and thanks for the advice. I know you guys are right. A little more background. I have been in this hobby for over 2 years, and I think everything has just come to a head. Even after all the talks I have had with my wife this week, I asked her if we could make love and she said no. I just don't think the spark is there for either one of us. And like you guys said, she is in a win-win.

The CR chica, while fun, I know is a hooker. I'm not even going to try and figure out the psychology, but I am glad that profession is out there. Below is the email exactly as she sent last night.

I know she could easily be playing me and in fact probably is, but she isn't asking for money to support her, take care of her cell phone bill, etc. She just wants to be with me. And while she may be a hooker, she didn't want my money. And she doesn't know I want to bring her up here.

Hola baby!

i wish for you that all about it finish good for you, and all i wan t is to be with you, this is what i feel, and i am not scared to tell you what i feel about you baby,
I am thinking about you all day long,i feel everyday different for me after i meet you and i miss your body by my side...
And all i want is to love you for long time.Is it good for you?
I feel butterflys inside me and my blood is warm..
I want to love you....
Kisses baby

Later guys,
Real (fucked up in the head)

Real Thrill. You are mixing oil and water.

You friend in Cost Rica sounds really nice, but she will be there when you are done with your wife.

If you really want to keep your wife, three things need to happen:

1. You need some conseling,
2. She needs some conseling, and
3. You need to quit this board.

If you only do 2 of these things, you will never salvage anything with your wife. You can always rejoin this board later if things do not work with your wife, but it is too easy to escape your current problems if things are not well at this moment with your wife by logging into the board and going off to DREAMLAND:

I am not a preacher, but if I were married, I would not be a member of this board. It is just to easy to escape relationship problems by logging in here.

Brother, I hope you put some efforts into the relationship with your wife. If she will not go to conseling, then she is not really into saving the marriage. If her pastor will not admit that conseling is needed, then he is unreal also.

You owe it to yourself first more then anything to solve your relationship issues with your wife. This does not mean that the marriage will survive, but it means that you will have done everything you could, and she would not step up to the plate to fix herself. It also means that she has unreal expectations.

You owe this to your daughter also.

I do not know what state you live in, but if your wifey finds out about your activities also, it could cost you more in a divorce. Even if it does not cause your more in a divorce, it could piss her off so much that after getting a divorce, it could be harder to see your daughter, and she will forever be in the ´´PAYBACK¨ mode.

Please be careful brother. You are playing with fire, and it is just too easy to get burned.

I wish you all the best. I would not trade your situation for anything.

The best defense is a good offsense. Quit being a piece of wet spegitti. Women are good at making us feel that way. Tell her that you are going to conseling, and that you expect her to do it also, and that things are over if she does not care enough to go. She will not expect you to push back. These days women do not expect men to push back, and they then loose respect for us. This does not mean that you are going to become a jerk, or agressive. You need to be assertive. It does not also hurt to cry in front of her, and do not be afraid to tell her that you are hurt because things are not the best between you two.

Men operate on logic. Women operate, and communicate on emotions. You need to she some emotions. If you are pissed off, tell her you are mad. This does not mean hitting her.

We do not understand the rules of women. When men play a game, they will finish the game even if they are not happy because men always stick to the rules. When women play a game, if they are not happy, they stop the game, change the rules, and then restart the game.

Your wife has stopped the game, is not playing now, and is trying to change the rules buddy.

If she will not have sex with you, ask her to sleep on the couch, or in another bedroom. DO NOT LEAVE THE BEDROOM YOURSELF. Tell her that the bedroom is for both of you as a married couple. Tell her that if she is not going to act as a married person, then she should not sleep in the married bedroom. DO NOT LET HER CHANGE THE RULES AND STAY IN THE BEDROOM BY CHANING THE RULES AND SAY THAT SEX IS NOT NEEDED.

These are some of the things you can do to be on the offensive. These are very emotional things, and if she really wants to stay married she will come around. IF DONE THE RIGHT WAY, THEY ARE ALSO VERY POWERFUL, and just might save your marriage.

OF COURSE, YOU MUST WANT TO SAVE YOUR MARRIAGE ALSO.

CP

Ditto, ditto, ditto - good words, CP! This board is the LAST place to go for marriage and relationship advice (kinda like curing alcoholism at a bar). Still, it's good for you, RealThrill to hear it from some guys who have been thru the fire.

BS

RT:

Assume the Nica is a puta, and that there is no chance of a lasting relationship there.

Then, make your decision upon that assumption.

I am a divorce attorney if you want to give me an inbox...I will tell you the steps you need to make to protect yourself...sounds like a question of when not if you get divorced....

Blazers, I am sure you are a great attorney, and I would certainly never dispute the advice on an attorney, but if RealThrill really wants to save his marriage, it may be too soon to talk to an attorney.

When someone starts to talk to an attorney, especially in a divorce case, it is past the point of being fixed.

Things to watch out for should have been covered in a prenuptial agreement. Things at this point are pretty much the way they are.

Blazers, you are right that you can help a guy cover his ass, but in a legal sense, by the time something gets to a divorce, things are pretty much cast in stone.

Here in California, people spend 1000´´s of dollars trying to outdue the other spouse, but in most cases, what is there is what is there, and the court pretty much cookie cutters each case.

Hopefully, Real Thrill can work things out wife the wife, and will not need an attorney. I am sure you can appreciate where I am.

CP

Keep in mind that you would not only be giving up on your relationship with your wife, but also your relationship with your kid(s). Next time you see you kid(s) take a good long look at them, then ask yourself if your being just a little bit self-centered.

I know we all have come to a point in our life's when we need kick ourselves in the ass and get the mid-life crisis under control. Good Luck


Dr.Phil

If it is any consolation, your dilemma is a common one. You are getting some pretty sage advice from board members here. Listen to these guys.

As far as marriage counseling is concerned...

There really are only three reasons why people go to marriage therapy:

(1) They want to improve their marriage.
(2) At least one of them is thinking (consciously or unconsciously) about leaving, and wants help deciding if it is worth staying
(3) At least one of them knows the relationship is over. They use counseling (consciously or unconsciously) as a place to dump their spouse. Often the idea is to leave the spouse in good hands, and feel less guilty about leaving.

You can save yourself some time and money by figuring out which of these is your reason for suggesting counseling. It sounds like your reason is probably (2) or (3).

If you love your (American) wife and consider her your friend, but want or need to fuck other women, then you are perhaps in a tough spot. But don't immediately assume that you need to get divorced. Some guys in this position actually explore hobby-friendly options with their wives. I have met a number of guys out there who manage to have honest long-term relationships with their wives/girlfriends, even though the wives know their husbands are participating in the hobby. It isn't impossible, but you have to be with the right woman, who can roll with your extracurricular fun. And, there's a whole world of women out there who tolerate infidelity -- "just don't tell me about it and don't bring any diseases home".

But if you are fairly certain that you want out, then from a psychological health point of view, it is healthier to get out than to force yourself to stay. Healthier for you and healthier for your kids. That is what the research shows. (On average, subtract 4 years from your life expectancy if your first marriage fails). It is best for you and your family if you can terminate things amicably, without making your children a battle ground.

If you want to assess your marriage quickly and cheaply, then take a look at John Gottman's book (with Nan Silver), "The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work." Read Chapter 2: "How I Predict Divorce." You can find that book at any decent book store.

Talking to an attorney makes sense whether you are hoping to save or dump your marriage. Protect your ass while you work this out. Get a clear picture of what you stand to gain or lose, and what you can do about it.

Since he's already emptying the piggy bank on mongering trips - I mean fishing trips - to CR, he probably needs to start protecting financial assets. I think that may be part of what Blazers is getting at. This is pretty high-risk behavior considering he and his wife are fighting. A quick borderhop to TJ or Nogie or somewhere and spending $100 for an hour of sex, parking and some beers is one thing. Multi-day, multi-thousand dollar trips to CR is something entirely different.

The risks of getting caught are much higher on a trip like that. And, if his wife suspects something and does some investigating, if a divorce filing is in the cards, then having evidence that he goes on sex vacations to Central America will not impress a chancery judge (or whatever judges handle divorce cases where he lives).

Bottom line - even if you love your wife and think the odds of divorce are slim, it never hurts to start minimizing your financial risk. If the odds are higher, then the need is that much greater. The same procedures that go with a business arraingment between two people should also apply to a marraige, particularly in this day and age.

A wife can feel that you are being dishonest. Having been in this position before, it was impossible for me to hide my girl friends on the side. I had the perfect cover stories, no money traces, etc. She could just feel it.

Been married twice. Horsed around on the first, and not on the second. Funny thing, the 2nd cheated in me.

Just remember, they can feel it even if they do not have the evidence on you.

CP

I agree...the NICA is out of the picture on this...it was great, and it fucked with me for a little, but the reality of my feelings for my wife have eclipsed those thoughts.

I feel like being a friend to my wife, I don't feel like being her lover. We were together last night for the first in over a month, and I had to almost pull teeth to get that. She only wanted to give me a HJ, and I told her I needed more than that with all that is going on. She told me to take her and when I started to position her in cowgirl, she said ouch that hurts, and rolled off. I finished as quick as I could in Mish with her underneath.

Afterwards she asked me what I was thinking. I told her that I loved her and our daughter, but I still feel like sex and a desire to be intimate and passionate is missing. I told her I am going to see a counselor this week to figure it out. My company pays for marriage counseling 100%, so why not go talk to someone.

I'm also going to talk to an attorney this week here in TX. It's funny, I've got the excess $ from CR to use until the attorney advises on how to move forward. Blazers, check your PM.

Truthfully, I've checked out of this marriage, but I hold no ill will towards my wife. Hopefully she will do this uncontested. I don't plan on fighting and making it ugly, because I want to be a part of my daughters life. My wife and I just grew in different directions, and now we want different things. She wants to be a stay at home, women's tennis league playing, volunteering at the school, having fun during the day mom.

She told me last night..."you work all day with people, then you come home to me and our daughter. Then I spend a few hours playing with my daughter, eating dinner, and then relax to wind down from the day." THen she say, "on the weekends I expect us to do EVERYTHING together as a family." I asked her if she values her alone time during the day, and she said yes. I then asked her, when is my alone time? Not at work, not at home, not on weekends because according to her, if I'm not with her and my daughter then I'm not being a part of the family and therefore a bad person. Uggghhhh!

I don't think I'll fall in this trap ever again. I will never give up my freedom to do what I want and what makes me happy.

Later,
Real

My three cents...having been there, done that.

First, there is no real urgency to the situation except what you are creating yourself. Relationships with women change dramatically, sometimes even over a short time.

It's pretty hard to keep your head in a marriage when both of your heads are involved someplace else. My first marriage slipped away because my wife kept waiting for me to get real involved in the emotional part of keeping our relationship going, but I was too involved in getting much better sex on the side.

An example: Wife is bitchy, doesn't want to put out, or even says things are going downhill in marriage. In times past I would have been all into the problem, talking, kissing, hugging, pledging my eternal love....but while distracted by sex on the side I found that my response was much more subdued...i.e...whatever, I'll get some on the side tomorrow.

I think this is what someone else was referring to above when they said that women sense when we are no longer committed to relationship....duh..
Women are all into making us fools for love. The love for us to make extravagant gestures and act like fools in all kinds of silly ways.

It should be obvious to anyone that a man mooning over a Nica is quite simply a fool of a different sort...

Lastly, and most importantly, I was a weekend dad for 15 years and had a great relationship with my ex-wife and participated in my daughter's life in every way...That couldn't even begin to touch what I have now with my seven year old boy at home. I see him every morning and every night. The last thing that I tell him every night when I tuck him in is that his Dad loves him.

There is no comparison between being a weekend dad and having your child in your home, either for you, or for the child. There's simply no comparison.

Be patient, show your wife in every way that you love her and cut the distractions emanating from the little head. At least if it doesn't work out you will know that you gave it your all.

One last thing. I always likened my divorce situation to the chicken and the egg riddle. I really don't which came first....Did I get someone on the side because my marriage was going downhill?.....or, did my marriage go downhill because I got someone on the side?

Oh yeah, I agree with CP....be Strong. There is no substitute in dealing with a woman. Sometimes they don't really know it ...but they need and crave a strong man.

Scarus

Real Thrill,

One day about 15 years ago, I was thinking of giving it all up, and running off with a beautiful girl from Europe. Then I took a look at one of my kids playing on the floor, and thought, "No matter how much I want the European girl, I can't leave these kids(3) without a daddy."

That was the best decision I ever made, as all three have grown up great and are doing well, and the stable family home life is intact.

This hobby is totally separate. If you can do it that way, then everyone benefits, most especialy, your child.

Moondog

Real Trill,

The CR puta made you feel again..That is the best thing that could of happened. Now you see your life in a proper light. Be the agressor with your wife. Treat her the way you want to be treated to get that feeling. You will find out the truths. Life is way to short not have it all. We do go through ups and downs, but the ups MUST be the norm. Today is today...the past is gone and tomorrow hasn't happened yet...

Good advice in this thread. My advice? Dump the wife AND the Nica. Each has her own agenda, neither is necessarily patent to an observer here or to the fellows in their lives, we all are living our own lives here on this planet. Permanent pair-bonding only works for storks and people who die soon after their marriage ceremonies. Which isn't to say, you can't tell the Nica you'd like to test out just how devoted she is to you, by means of several more hot passionate visits this upcoming summer ... and if it turns out she's for real (which you will assiduously test with all the skepticism you can muster) then HEY! you've found a real catch, not a fake one.

Update to this saga for those that are interested...

Went to a marriage counselor today, and I was guilty before we even sat down. The therapist alluded the entire time that I had an affair. I was only asked once, and denied with a straightforward and simple, "No". I didn't get defensive, and every other time that an affair was insinuated, I ignored it as if it didn't apply.

Basically, my feelings for my wife are that of friends. Neither one of us has an interest in having sex with each other right now. My wife's mother is accusing me of cheating, my wife has bought 3 different save your marriage books over the past week, and everyone of them says that if you cut your husband off on sex, he'll go somewhere else and get it. EVERY BOOK SAYS THAT! Here I am denying it to the hilt with a straight face. There's no proof, so why not. My wife told the therapist today that she doesn't trust me anymore.

I have an appointment with an attorney on Friday to determine next steps. My goal is to get this done uncontested, end things as amicably as possible and get on with life.

Send me your off-line e-mail (on CH Inbox). I will send you the Alimony book.

Sounds like you are committed to going through with this.

Several books you may want to get as well;

-Moms house, Dads House;
-Ten stupid things men do to mess up their lives;

I am in complete agreement with your strategy when confronted: Deny, deny, deny

Lastly, forget about the Nica as she will only become a passing ship in the night...and there will be many...if you can afford it after the the courts get through with you.

Brother, your relationship with your daughter will never be the same...get used to it...it is a hard pill to swallow!

G'luck;

Sandman

Real Thrill, about 11 years ago I went through the same scenario as you are going through, but with a few different twists. I came home from my twice yearly weekend hunting club trip to South Texas-read Nuevo Laredo, Boystown, drinking, gambling and bird hunting/golfing, etc., to be told by my wife that she didn't love me anymore, didn't want to take care of the kids-two boys that were 4 and 6 at the time and that she just wanted to be single. She had absolutely no idea what was going on with the hunting trips. Other than two weekends a year, my family was my life. We went the marriage counselor route, where I was told that what I should do is to get her an apartment, furnish it, pay the rent, etc., etc.-she hadn't worked since we had the first son-and let her sort things out. Of course, I thought this was crazy and just tried to work things out at home. A few months into this, I get a call from this guys wife to let me know that the weekend I was away that my wife and her husband had gotten it on in the bar that her husband owned and she was telling me now because she was pissed at him for some other girls she had caught him with.
Even with this, I tried as hard as I could to keep the marriage together for the sake of my sons. I fought the situation for nine miserable months. Nine months I now wish that I had avoided. When I finally decided to see an attorney, I had already decided to go through with a divorce no matter what. The divorce was
uncontested, I got everything except her personal items and her three pickup truck loads of shoes and clothes-which I hand delivered to her mothers house. Kids were with me, the house, the furniture, etc. She was even supposed to pay me child support-something I insisted on not because I needed the money for the kids, but at least wanted to recoup some of what I was having to pay on her credit cards that were in my name. A year later I wanted to move to a different city-she sued me for custody of my boys. I walked into the court supremely confident that I would win. Wasn't the case. I was treated like a criminal. Ended up that she got joint custody, I could move but couldn't move the kids out of the county, and I had to pay
child support. I really took a good fucking.
The happy ending though is that although I still am in the same city, both boys live with me now, they both totally disrespect their mother-something I have gone way out of my way to discourage-her attitude and actions over the years have made them that way. She never really wanted the custody, just wanted to stop me from taking them to a different state. She is in the middle of her third divorce-I know the guy fairly well-the poor miserable bastard. My son told me the other night that if he ever made it big that he would buy me a palace in Brazil. I asked him about his Mom and he said "Fuck her, she can live in a nursing home." As for me, I have spent the last six or seven years with as many latin lovelies as possible. Approximately 40 trips to Costa Rica, 4 trips to Brazil and numerous trips to the border towns of Mexico have more than compensated for the bad times.
As for the kids, my advice is to always take the high road at all times. Your daughter is going to be affected, one way or the other. I hate what the divorce has done to affect my boys, but I know that I did everything I could to maintain their respect for me and their mother-even if I thank my lucky stars for her getting rid of me.
The point of this long, rambling story is that chances are high that every step of the way you are going to be the bad guy, but that doesn't mean that in the end it will all be bad for you.
I wish you the best.

Real Thrill,

You may know this but I still have to say it.
Long term relationships, marriages.. well.. the passion will fizzle out. I was in a steady relationship for 5 yrs, and we were friends. It's good that you and your wife are like friends. Some couples are at each other's throat. The fact that she bought 3 books suggests she still wants to save the marriage.

Whoever the hottie is, whether she is Thai, Brazillian or Mexican etc, she will tell you she loves you , she misses you, she just wants to be with you etc. How real that is is debatable. How long that will last is also uncertain. If you don't have that fat American salary, that U.S. citizenship will she still love you? Who knows.

I'm just saying think twice before throwing away what is real and permanant, a stable relationship with your wife and kids. Consider mongering on the side while keeping your marriage. In a year you probably wouldn't think of your GF as that special and worth leaving your wife and kids for.

Good luck.

-DJ

All great pieces of advice. Thank you everyone. The Nica is not in this picture anymore. My experience with her had me fucked up in the head for about a week, but hey she is a hooker looking to better her life at whatever the cost.

Over the past 2 weeks my wife and I have done a lot of soul searching. She wants to save the marriage, the problem is that I still haven't come to that decision. My wife cries at the drop of a hat, and I haven't shed a tear (she made that a point to bring up to the therapist, that I have no emotion.)

I look at how my wife likes to control most of the situations in the house, how she likes to control me, and control our daughter. The problem is that when we got married 11 years ago, I gave her that control and the ability to do that. Maybe it was because she was/is a trophy and I didn't want to give lose that. I was definitely whipped back then. No matter what the reason, I should have kept most of the control, and handed it out sparingly. Now she has control over her box, my happiness, and as many decisions as she wants in the house.

Trying to get that back, has proven very difficult. My wife told me this week, "I hate the control you have taken in the household." But guys, I like it!

But having this control hasn't made me love my wife any more or any less. It has just caused more pain. I just don't think that I fully love my wife right now, and I don't know if I can or want to get that feeling back. Maybe I'm not supposed to have that lusty desire for my wife after 11 years of marriage, and if that's the case then am I supposed to go through life feeling like I'm missing something?

I don't think the grass is greener being single, but I know it's different than what I have now. And settling into a rut at home isn't what I want.

I had drinks with one of my neighbors last night. He and his wife went through this about 2 years ago. He told me to give it all up. He said, "Give her the control she wants, let her control the sex because she's the gatekeeper anyway." He says if she has that power, you'll get what you want returned multiple times over. I don't agree with him, but that is what he has done and he says he happy. I think he is being a bit of a "doormat" and now his wife tells the other wives in the neighborhood that she has him trained just the way she wants.

Like I said in an earlier post, my daughter's education is already paid for. I am and will continue to be involved in her life, I am in no way giving that up. In fact, it looks like I will have to pay about $2,000 month in child support under my states law. Alimony is for 3 years to my wife and will cost me another $1,500 per month. I don't know if those are pre or post tax #'s, but I will find that out shortly.

Unless I can find a way to fall back in love with her in the next month. We'll see.

Later,
Real

Alimony pre-tax, Child SUpport post-tax, and hooooly cow!

Good luck..

BS

Well, actually it is all post tax when you make the payments but you get to deduct the alimony payments at the end of the year when you file.

Lucky to only have 3 years of Alimony though.

RT,

I can understand your feelings of missing out on life by staying in the marriage.

And she was once a trophy? And now she's crying at the drop of a hat?

Is there anyway to spice things up in the marriage?

;0

-DickJ

(Message edited by DickJohnson on June 11, 2003)

She is still a trophy. She is 5'8" tall 115 lbs. Total model body. Looks have nothing to do with this.

Here's the BCD scoop: She refuses to give BJ's (says its gross to think of what she's sucking on.) Refuses to go doggie of any type, says that position pushes bacteria from behind to her vagina and causes her infections. Will not do cowgirl or reverse cowgirl because it hurts. Does not let me lay her on the edge of the bed, pick her legs up in the air and start with her because that also hurts.

After 10 years of telling her to get her lower back checked on why that hurts and why she has such pain in the lower back she refuses to see an orthopedist or chiropractor to get it checked out.

The only things we can do in bed are: mish her on top, mish me on top, she will give me HJ, or she will let me DATY her once maybe every 6 months.

A couple of other things. I am no longer than 6" and about as think as the cardboard insert on a toilet paper roll. Nothing big here guys. I am 6' tall and weigh 186 lbs and work out 3 times a week. Our neighbors have termed us the barbie and ken couple.

When I used to do DATY on pro's, I had one actually not take my money for the session because she had such a good time with my oral and orgasmed multiple times with me eating her out. My wife told me the reason she doesn't let me do oral more is because she feels guilty of not doing it for me.

My wife says she wants to fix our marriage, and that she wants to be creative in the bedroom as long as it doesn't hurt her or put her at risk of infection. But then she said she can't have sex with me right now, because of my feelings towards her. She told me I need to be patient and rebuild our love back up from the beginning. So she wants lots of I love you's, holding hands, notes left for her to find, and no sex until she feels I am love with her again.

Guys my issue is and continues to be no sex, and now it's right there in my face that it isn't happening in the foreseeable future. And when I do get it, it won't be creative because everything I've tried with her hurts or freaks her out mentally.

She is still controlling this situation, and I'm whacking off since I'm not getting it at home.

Dude, you married an ice queen. Good looks, bad attitude.

A friend of mine is in your exact situation - married a real hottie from college who will only have sex on Saturday nights, missionary (her on the bottom) only, he doesn't even get handjobs. No DATY whatsoever, and she has never blown him once. They did not have sex before marraige (she wanted to save herself).

Murasaki's #1 rule in life: NEVER marry a virgin! And no, I didn't learn that in kindergarten.

OK, so I am at my best friends wedding. We are getting ready to start the ceremony, and I can't find the groom! I go looking everywhere, and finally see him walking down the hall with a HUGE grin on his face.

What the hell, I ask him! He tells me about the BEST blow job he has ever gotten in his life - in a changing room from his soon bride to be. He is real happy, looking forward to this great sex life with this hot woman, who gives these great blow jobs.

Later I overhear his bride telling her bridesmaid that she just gave the groom the last blow job of her life.

That's an old joke that is also a truism !

Real_thrill,

I was unhappily married for 8 years and finally realized the future looked bleak. Tried counseling to no avail. One Saturday morning after an ugly Friday night fight I hopped in the RV, drove to a nearby RV park and took it from there, never spent another night with her. Divorce was final about a year later. The next couple of years were emotionally and financially trying but things eventually got on an even keel. Now I can say it was one of the best decisions I ever made. We didn't have kids and kids are a tremendous complication.

Maybe you should get your own counselor for professional advice on how to minimize the impact of a trial separation on your daughter. Separation but not divorce removes the child support / alimony / lawyer costs and gives you both a new perspective on things that will help the decision making process.

RT:

Take your wife down the here obgyn and have a talk. In most cases, the doc will probably agree with you. This just might help your wife get over the fears.

I once had a girl friend that had some issues with me about sex. Called the doc, sat us down in a conference for a 15 minute meeting. A week later it was as if the problem never existed.

If you wife will not go discuss the problems with a doc, she may not really want to solve things.

A doc visit sure bets the bills associated with a divorce.

CP

RT, one thing I would add to this mix regards your daughter. Just wanted to say that if you're drastically worried about the impact on her, and are thinking of staying in a sexless, loveless marriage because of that, don't. It's the biggest mistake you can make.

Children are far more resilient about divorce than many adults think they are. I was 7 when my parents divorced, and it barely made an impact. Their marriage was roadkill and my mother was in misery. For everyone's sake, it was best that the marriage end. It will be tough on your daughter for a few months, but that's about it. Kids get over it quickly, especially given the fact that there are so many kids out there who's parents are divorced. It's the norm in this day and age.

Just another two cents.

M

Tried for sex last night with my wife to see how it would feel to the two of us. Guess what the answer was? "No, my period started and I'm bleeding heavy right now, maybe next week."

My meeting with the attorney is tomorrow at 11. I will make sure to get all the legal advice I need from him. Shortly, I will tell my wife that things aren't improving for me, and that I think we need to end this as amicably as possible for our daughters sake.

Funny, my wife found out that one of our neighbors is going through the same thing, but it is the wife that has the same type of feelings I do towards her husband. I guess this is more common than people let on.

Thanks for all the advice. I know it will be hard on our daughter at first, but I truly believe she will adjust. I plan on being a part of her life even if it is weekends.

And, I won't make this mistake again. If I get involved with someone again, and I'm sure I will, there will be a pre-nup or nothing, and at the first sign of shutting things down, I will put my foot down and make things right, or she's history. So I'm thinking someday I need to pick an Asian or Latin American woman that treats her man the way I want to be treated.

Later,
Real

If you are going to go through with the divorce, make sure you stay away from mongering, and chasing women for the next few months until you have a property settlement, and things are in place so they cannot be changed.

There is nothing like a pissed off wife when going through a divorce, and other women will only cost you mucho more bucks.

CP

Very interesting following your posts, the readers, fellow divorced males, etc. WOW, these are some pretty sharp guys, so I think you are getting FREE counseling out of this with some amazing insights.

Of course when you read this much - a LONG thread - something catches your attention. For me (having been in divorce proceedings for three years now) I noticed something about POWER. You know having an affair, or mongering or whatever you call it ....is very intoxicating. You feel like you are in POWER, you are getting your needs met in a way that is seductive.

It is natural that this power shift is definately NOTICED by wifes and girlfriends, or whomever. They may not know you are having an affair, unless they have had a spouse "mongering" before and found out, AND I AGREE, never never never admit to it. This just hurts both parties... (Of course, it is an easy way for you to make a real enemy of your wife and daughter and THEN see what awaits you in the courts!)... I think this power shift is what you perceive of as not loving your wife anymore and your wife perceives as you being a control freak....

So, like many guys recommended, one of the things YOU can do to find out if you really love her and want to avoid all the pain and agony of divorce (not so much your wife, but DIVORCE FROM YOUR DAUGHTER!!!) is to stop mongering for a while, cancel any affairs and REALLY think this thru.

If the power in the relationship stabilizes in a way that works for both of you, ie your marriage "matures" to a new level...you may not want to monger any more. It may cause just the opposite shift, she gets control again, you feel stifled and go outside the marriage for sex, intimacy, etc. (PS Most men have affairs for intimacy, NOT sex! - ask your shrink) YOu may discover a new level of love in your life, be happy and have a great time as a family.

[ A heavy but good book to read on RELATIONSHIPS (every guys favorite word...) is Passionate Marriage..Wish I read it years before. ]

I kind of hope this is the case for you, but these posts show progressive deterioration in this marriage, at a very rapid pace. So, you are headed for divorce right now.

Far from horror stories, I can tell you that after three years of divorce (estate issues..) I am finally getting over it. She is too. But she still wont talk to me, my daughter (17) "is mad" at me - maybe all teenagers do this...and I guess that is the hardest part. I think losing the love of your daughter is a very real side effect of divorce, while it will come back to you some day, it might not be worth it if you can just FIX what is wrong, rather than just change railroad cars in the middle of the train wreck.

So, forgive the advice...but since you are financially stable, and out of love with your wife, I ask you. Do you still love your daughter, can you find a way to fall back in love with your wife, and if not, do take the advice of EVERYONE that posted here and cover your ass(ets) carefully. It is not going to be easy going this route, but only you know what is going on inside you, so you have to be true to it. As far as Divorce goes, uncontested or not, it takes a long long time for all parties involved to become whole again and heal. SO be prepared.

PS. Heading to CR first time on June 22 for three weeks, surfing, mongering, and having FUN. Any readers want to contact me, I will buy the beer.

Well, RT, it's definitely not just you who's not getting any: http://www.msnbc.com/news/928868.asp?0ql=c7p

In the last five years I've been through a high-end, Silicon Valley venture capital-supported Internet failure (April 2000 in the capital markets crash just days from closing our 3rd round of VC financing) and a very expensive, very nasty divorce. But I have 3 great things going for me now. First, our hobby. while I date American women from time to time, I party hard only in Latin America and on a very regular basis. In the last year I've been to Costa Rica twice, Buenas Aires twice, and Lima once, and I;m getting ready to go to BA and Rio (yeah, RIO!!) next month. Secondly, whereas I used to be a hard-charging executive for at least two Fortune 1000 companies in my career, now I work for myself. I still do fine but the freedom is AWESOME!! (see 1 above). Third, and most important, I co-parent my kids ( a 9 year old daughter and an 11 year old son) - 50% of the time they're with me. Real Thrill - I highly recommend that you not commit to any long-term relationshiop now - no matter how gorgeous or sexy she is, Nica, Tica, Portena, American, whatever - except for one with your daughter. Square your shoulders and demand 50-50 parenting rights . As my brother told me 5 years ago, pay now or pay later - and now is really cheaper. Just fit your mongering in around the edges - you'll do fine, bro!!

Planetjack,

Thanks man. The Nica is off the table, a hobby friend, told me in straight up terms that sunk in "Nica's are looking to escape an impoverished country and no future. They are masters at picking up on men's needs, and fulfilling those needs to escape whatever it is they are trying to get away from. She probably sensed your craving for love and affection and a real relationship, and that's what she picked up on." He was spot on, although her story hasn't changed, I was being weak, both heads are back on straight.

The papers are drawn up, but the attorney is waiting on my word to file. My wife knows that is what I am thinking and leaning to right now. However, she has changed her attitude 180 degrees. All of sudden, sex isn't so painful, she's willing to try new things, and she's not controlling me, I'm controlling all the situations.

In fact, she told me again tonight that I have total control of our house right now and she doesn't like it. Then she started to cry, and I said I had to get to another meeting and said bye. She can cry on her own, I don't feel like listening to it.

Keeping my daughter in my life is the one thing I know I will make happen. She's the only reason I haven't already filed. The question is, can my wife stay in the relationship with me driving again, and will she keep up the bedroom antics of the last 2 weeks? Only time will tell.

Ok, Well I read this thread and there has been nothing posted on this for about a year. I wonder what the outcome was to Real thrills' dilemma?

What I can say from my own personal experience is this. While there are many married lads on this board who are able to separate either actually living the life or living vicariously through others (as I did for about 5 years or so). I really think for some people this board is a "train wreck" waiting to happen. I am one of those people.

My story is pretty simple. About 5 years or so ago I was surfing late one night on the net. I was awfully bored and stumbled on the old WSG. Information about Nuevo Laredo kind of sparked my interest so I searched, and came across the old Red Snake Board. This was about the time of its' demise (the whole 'Lakers' fiasco...whatever happened with him and his venture into web capitalism ?) This board was just getting going (ah the good ole for free days.) Well, to cut to the chase I got REAL excited. Could hardly wait to make the airline reservations (I never have figured out WHY I picked Nuevo Laredo over TJ...) I was in this typical type of marriage described. I was married to a total trophy chick. she actually looked like her namesake (Barbie.) We had a young son together. The sex was just not there. Oh I mean she would do her duty sex once a week. It was just not what I needed.... I was also very young (26.) So I figured hey what could a little harmless mongering hurt? Well, plenty to say the least.

I won't bore you fellows with the gory details. needless to say it was something akin to my life being destroyed. Just Horrible. Now, do I hold the hobby or this (or any other) board responsible? Ofcourse not. I think what happened to me by going to NL and then other locals (always Latin women, for me thank you. I have never been interested in visiting in Asia.) opened me to what I thought I truly wanted to have. In the end I found out I was married to someone I really was in love with, and wanted to be with. To late, sadly. So now where am I? Well, I embraced my destruction and moved to Corpus Christi (short hop skip and a jump to Laredo.) from a south eastern state. As, the song says mothers tell your children not to do what I have done. Seriously though - When you decide to terminate a relationship think it out. Ofcourse sometimes it is the best thing to end it (I don't know maybe even MOST of the time.) And if you are thinking about calling it quits do to a desire to live the "free" life of our hobby, step back from this board and the hobby for a while to give it some perspective. Just my two cents... still I wonder what happened?

Quickie divorce? I need a quickie divorce. My wife cannot travel to the United States. I know you can get quicke marriages in places like the Bahamas but does anyone know a country where I can get a quickie divorce?

SOG,

The Dominican seems to be a good place to go these days. Any chance of just getting an anulment?

This is a 2 year old thread.....I enjoyed every bit of it....wow...i read the whole thing....Im interested in what happened to the saga also....

15 years ago I went through almost the exact scenario...I left...divorced her...now Im happier than ever...new wife...new life..and still a monger...its in my blood...but the one thing that I will always regret.....my son suffered from me not being there...EVERYDAY........for him.

The divorce was the best for me...the worse for him