Subtopic	Posts		Updated
	Archive 01	50		2003/06/26, 04:30 am

"I almost gave the award to Ben, but the bastard never put me in his will. (That's really true, honest injun)."

Hey, Watch your comments about Indians. I is part one.

Which reminds me that it is much better to be Indian in Oklahoma than any other type of minority. The reason being is that the majority of the Indians in Oklahoma have assimilated into the mainstream.

One of the reasons this happened was that if you are at least 1/4 Indian you were guaranteed entrance and free tuition and books at all state universities. Hmmmm, sound like Oklahoma really fucked up by giving these Indians a hand up and discriminating against whitey.

They even passed a law in Oklahoma that said Indians were not allowed to sell the mineral rights to their own land.

Was it very insulting, as it suggests that Indians were stupid and would sell all of the oil under the ground? Ask their grandchildren who get those royalty checks each month.

Dogster, Screw you, I am taking my porn and going home.

(The above images are copywritten material, property of GCL Technology, LTDA. No duplication or distribution is authorized without the expressed written permission of GCL Tech).

HEY DOGGIE;

A friend just sent this to me and I thought you might find it useful when you are struggling for something witty to say;

>Something for the professionals on the list, and the ever growing (though recently slightly abated) number of professional wannabes, to help craft just the right positioning phrases to baffle your clients, stuff your resume, or confuse your staff with complete and utter bullshit:

http://www.dack.com/web/bullshit.html

The site is trying to sell music (I think)and I have absolutely no affiliation


Sandman...funny as hell really!

Verry Funny, Sandman…. Here’s what I came up with.

Harness intuitive partnerships

Unleash user-centric services

Maximize sticky platforms

Create sexy applications

Seize global vortals

Enable end to end portals

Exploit interactive niches

Drive back-end channels

…

Bullshit??? I think not. That thing is fuckin brilliant. Hell, I did all of those things in TJ during my last visit.

And here are a few for GCL:

Enable Mac-accessible Sexxxychat

Discover widely-used FTP


Anyway, the general responses of CH membership to the topic of AA are all very shallow. It is clear that none of you has a brain. Now I understand why this country is being taken over by fascists, so thank you.

Lester Maddox… Strom Thurmond… Two famous jurassic segregationists bite the dust. As the political winds shifted during the last century, these dudes moderated their extremism somewhat. But so what? Is there any reason to mourn the loss of these fuckers? I don't think so.

In the wake of the latest Supreme court rulings, the debate over affirmative action has new vigor, except perhaps at Club Hombre. For who knows what reasons, Texas is about to scuttle its race-neutral admissions programs at its universities.

"The Texas and California (race neutral admissions) programs have a mixed record, with minority enrollment holding steady or up only slightly at most schools, and lower at competitive schools like UC-Berkeley. " - US News and World Report

The ILLUSION is that AA creates diversity, and that it wouldn't happen on its own.

"Embracing diversity in meaningful ways with nondiscriminatory practices has yielded a better result for African-American and Hispanic students in our state," Jeb Bush, Florida Governor

How typical of a Democrat to not mention Robert Byrd.

You know, the guy that use to belong to the KKK and is the oldest living Dem Senator. Along with you, he has a great dislike for George W.

Just wanted to make sure we keep it fair. I know deep down in your liberal heart you would want to keep it fair.

In the Senate they call Robert Byrd "Sheets".

But only democrats are allowed to have racist skeletons in their closet. Because after all the dems know whats best for minorities. They need to stay on the ideological plantation.

Batster

Batster1,

"They need to stay on the ideological plantation."

I like that. I think I first heard it used by Harry Bellafonte.

Did he steal that from you are from someone else?

Just dropped by to have me a banana from de ol' Jamaica plantation.

The evil of Strom, and Byrd, isn't their past ideologies but the fact that they were/are permanent fixtures in government. With so many parasites in government who have never worked an honest day in their lives it's a wonder anything still functions in this country. If this was Stalin Russia both of these guys would be mummified with their right hands on the voting button in the Senate and with electrical circuits that would make them move once every hour. Children would be bussed in for special days (with teachers getting double pay of course) to learn how their government works and would get to listen to the mummies give a short speech.

How can you guys be dissing Strom Thurmond? When he was in his late sixties, he hooked up with a 23-year old beauty queen and fathered four children with her.

I got the impression Byrd was still alive -- Thurmond is clinically brain-dead (heh just kidding), and Helms just died. Isn't Byrd still alive? Heck, I can't keep 'em all straight. They come in threes is all I know ...

Thurmond just died. Thats why I posted that...

Byrd is alive, as far as I know. Here's a recent picture of him recieving an honorary doctorate from some university somewhere. I'm not quite sure where. I can't quite place the cap and gown.


Jesus fucking christ, I'm not a "liberal." I'm simply not a right-wing whack like most of you. Conservativism in its healthy form favors restraint of govenment, personal responsibility, and private liberty.

Maybe the best way to decide if you are a conservative or a liberal in the sense that most of you mean it is to figure out who you will miss less -- Strom Thurmond or Patrick Moynihan. They are two very different types of Bozos.

Dogster, that looks like the outfit that GreenPeace uses.

Thurmond died 8 years ago. Those were just reflex spasms that everyone saw on TV when he was wheeled into the Senate to vote. His aides got so they could actually time the spasms to match the moments where it was necessary to raise his hand.

Ben,

Damn, I did not remember to document my sources. I should write for the times.

I heard this a while back in a column by Uncle Thomas Sowell.

Batstertheplagiarist

At my age, I am just proud of myself when I remember something from the past.

My problem is I don't remember what happened yesterday.

I (almost) always enjoy your insight and ideas relating to national and international events.

I plan on having an international event today.

Dogster's Mailbag

Thanks to the legions of my loyal readers for the numerous private communications that I have received regarding this thread. Many of you have chosen to remain silent, which is a shame, but I shall respect your hard earned right to privacy. This is after all a democratic and free country that not only tolerates but thrives upon differences of opinion. Personally, I am thankful for the possibility, however remote, that any FBI records on me just got longer and more difficult to interpret. Should you have any further questions about life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, simply aske Dogster…

One message I received was from a former member of the site I will call "Sven from Ireland." He wrote,

I just read your AA thread. Thanks for sending it to me, as requested. What a riot. You sir have risen/sunk to a new level. (brilliant? ahead of his time? or the next unibomber?)

Tackling the racial/social woes of society will invite many differing
opinions. Kudos on your ability to perch on such a precarious soapbox.
Many who haven't met you might immediately dismiss your tyrades as
inflammatory (that's what ther were anyway, right?). You simply are not PC. But you dropped the gloves and spoke your mind anyways. What's more, you defended your position logically. Perhaps more than anyone else on the board, Ben and Batster offered the most pithy responses.

Where I see you as having fallen short of the mark? You never suggested a viable alternative to the current AA policies. Do you have suggestions
beyond killing the program? <:-) ;) "If you're not a part of the solution, you're a part of the problem"

By the way, feel free to post this as Sven from Irelands' take on the matter. hehehe

At any rate, here was my response to DonSven:

Sven:

Solution: Kill Affirmative Action. Just end it. That is the solution. People like you always feel that the government should step in and "do" something. That is the problem, no matter how well meaning.

The solution is (1) Just Terminate the policy. Then (2) step back. If you think that certain races will sink, then you are indeed racist, even if it is veiled in self-righteous desire to "help." Once that happens, society is again free to operate without the government trying to idiot proof everything. And the races you pity will be able to thrive without a patronizing crutch.

That is a good way to start a race riot. Can you imagine LA with 3% of the police force black? Without some type of affirmative action that's how most big cities forces would look.

(Message edited by katokay on July 04, 2003)

In my opinion the race situation in the US can not get much worse. I have two black ex-classmates, who feel race relations in the US are worst now in 2003 than in the 1980's when we were studying together. They lay the blame primarily at the feet of Black Activists who fan racial animosities and have absolutely no interest in improving the plight of blacks.

I am fairly neutral on AA for employment but for academics I think it hurts many minorities. The high rate of incompletion of minorities is due in part to the fact that young men and women are allowed into programs that they are not academically qualified for. This guarantees failure. And thats not racist because there are a shitload of white boys, like myself, that could not get in either.

Batster

The thing I don't understand about the impact of Affirmative Action on academic programs, is how come schools get to pick which minorities to affirmatively act upon? In follow-up to the comment that a high percentage of minority students do poorly because their admission was partly done on the basis of poorer criteria but greater Affirmative Action ... why doesn't Harvard have to check ITS OWN population and then admit minorities to rebalance?

Instead, Harvard checks the USA population, admits more blacks and asians, and that counts as Affirmative Action. Why don't they have to check their own enrolment, realize they have too few white trash fundamentalists relative to how many computer-nerd asian math geniuses they have, and admit more people from Kentucky trailer parks, or children of charismatic Pentecostalist ministers? What laws / regulations determine which thing is a minority where?

Tight Fit,

Great comments. LOL. I need some Affirmative action. I am a friggin hillbilly. I need some
protection also.

LOL.

Seriously, though, to answer TF, the AA approach in 2003 in university admission offices (and elsewhere) serves an important political purpose. It is part of a larger campaign avanced by the courts and in the legislature to allocate social rewards based not on achievement but on race. This campaign is irrelevant to the concept of civil rights as Martin Luther King understood it. Indeed it has little to do with proven cases of unwarranted discrimination, or with assisting underpriviledged, underserved populations. Rather, it is best understood as a patronage system for the current, entitled civil rights establishment.

Such patronage works through dual pressure from outside groups like the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights and the Lawyers' Committee on Civil Rights, and inside groups such as the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and the Civl Rights Division of the Department of Justice. Instead of identifying and combating discrimination, these organizations are now in the business of manipulating the issue of discrimination in order to secure handsome reparations, payoffs, and jobs for its constituencies.

As you point out, the status quo strategy is simple. If a university (or employer) has a racial composition that is out of proportion with the ethnic breakdown of the relevant population, then the University (or employer) is presumed guilty of illegal discrimination.

Such a policy increases divisions and racism, rather than decreasing it. The liberal crusade (ugh, there, I said it) against racism is detrimental to both blacks and whites, as both can tell you. It seems that our next step, if we want to build a harmonious multiracial society, needs to be to eliminate race as the basis for public policy--eliminate the crutches. Then, we will be able to re-focus on higher ideals, like providing society-wide quality educational choices for all walks of people. In other words, broad-based programs to upgrade education and make it accessible are a better investment than self-centered, self-perpetuating, divisive, racist entitlement programs.

This is pretty obvious, but most of you at this site and in the US have been conditioned to think stupidly about this issue.

Book Guy has a great point. The real failure of all the AA programs is their internal and inherent racism. Certain ethnic groups go to the head of the line while others are totally ignored. The whole thing is a joke which has made a few select individuals and groups filthy rich which condeming the rest to act out a modern hip hop version of Step 'n' Fetch Em.

It's always being fun to watch the hassles in UC Berkeley concerning students of Asian descent. On one hand they are lumped together with all the other "people of color" when it comes time to stand in solidarity against "white male oppression". On the other hand the fact that they consistently dominate the lists of overachievers gives no end to whinning by other minorities that something is not fair.

The tendency for the media, and liberals in general, to combine all people of Latino descent together is another joke. Within different groups of Latinos there is quite often vast differences and antagonisms to one another. Listen to virtually any Latino who is non Mexican talk about Mexicans, or Chicanos if you REALLY want to hear something, and you will hear 100% derogatory comments. Ditto when it comes to viewing Puerto Ricans or Miami Cubans. Unless it is the Puerto Ricans or Cubans who will make sure you understand the ethnic and cultural superiority of THEIR "raza". I can just imagine the "head start" line at your local government give away office where a lily white aristocratic looking Cubano is standing next to some Peruvian who looks like he stepped off the Inca Conga review.

We now see the logical lunacy of all this continual dissecting people into smaller and smaller groups to forment hatred between them. A typical government form may have over 12 boxes to select from when you are forced to list your race. At the same time the "outs" bitch about not having THEIR sub group included on the list, the "ins" are trashed by being named as a color, or maybe lack of a color if that is what white means. Anyone who thinks coming from a European background means you are homoginous obviously skipped through the classes about the centuries of conflict between England, France, Spain, Rome, and all the rest. And if we get sucked into "saving" Liberia maybe we will get a lesson about the huge tribal and cultural differences in Africa and the stupidity of the entire notion of someone being Afro American.

The final, I hope anyway, show is getting underway at this very moment as gender issues, and some religious ones, compete against socalled racial differences and injustices. And it is not just male/female gender but the whole idea of sexual persuasion that keeps poking its head up and demanding rights. Are the little boxes on the government forms going to be doubled or tripled now that we have Gay Hispanics of Colombian Afro Carribbean, Transvestite Samoans, and Lesbian Koreans born in Japan? Are the advocates for female issues going to part ways along ethnic lines as anyone can see that the typical blue collar Afro American woman has next to nothing in common with the elite Eastern educated childless single white woman. And what about the Afro Americans who are embracing Islam while the NAACP continues to derive the bulk of its financal support from Jewish donations?

In the Northwest US long time environmental laws have protected the salmon from being over fished while insuring the rivers that they need to spawn in are clean and fast flowing. Another part of Disney Kingdom that has been protected are the sea lions who were nearly exterminated at one time. Finally, we have the Native Americans who may not yet have a casino but do have unapproachable rights to "harvest" their land in a manner that preserves their cultural heritage. The idealists are proud in what they have accomplished with their affirmative action environmentalism.

Unfortunately, the sea lions are having a field day with open season on salmon as they return from the sea to enter their individual rivers. And some of the Native Americans are making children on Seasame Street cry with their bloody butchering of animals in the name of some 1000 year old cleansing practice. And there have been several ungrateful whales in all this who won't return to the wild where they have to fend for themselves.

It all ties together in a messy knot just like the affirmative action programs. The "building" just grows and grows with more add ons to correct something that collapsed elsewhere. You push in one side and something, something important, pops out on the other side. Someday the whole thing is going to come down in a big crash.

"The real failure of all the AA programs is their internal and inherent racism."

Some excellent, enlightened posts. Not to sound patronizing or insulting, but I just hope that the pro-racism crowd is reading this (Kidcisco, Superman, Kendricks and Laguy), and maybe even understanding this.

"The real failure of all the AA programs is their internal and inherent racism."

Now I'm intrigued. I never heard that racism has found it's way into Alcoholics Anonymous. What is this world coming to.

Knock it off Snapper, this is serious shit.

Dogster barks: "Some excellent, enlightened posts. Not to sound patronizing or insulting, but I just hope that the pro-racism crowd is reading this (Kidcisco, Superman, Kendricks and Laguy), and maybe even understanding this."

Yeah, Dogster, I suppose I am really pro-racism based on the fact that I raised objections to the style of your uncivil, insulting posts and your spamming the chat boards with your self-important nonsense. I guess with Dogster, arrogance and stupidity know no bounds. It's amazing that even a cretin such as you can make such a comment without even knowing one iota about what my views are on affirmative action, views that you have nonetheless in your infinite stupidity concluded are racist. Get a fucking life and stop using this board for your own psychotherapy. Maybe one of these days you'll finally post something on topic: "Trip Report: Dogster goes to his bedroom, falls in love, has an epiphany while sucking his own dick, and exclaims: 'I sure love the white stuff.'"

(Message edited by LAguy on July 08, 2003)

Thanks for continuing to read this thread even though it isn't interesting to you. We can all learn something from people as polite and humble as you.

Good point. Lo siento. I'm terribly sorry for calling you a racist. It is equally possible that you are an aggessively apathetic moron.

Hey,

How about me?

I have always considered myself a racis.