Does Mexico have the equivalent of our Prenuptial agreements? Assuming that she signs the prenup to clear the way so we can marry (in Mexico), fix her papers and finally bring her over. So if the mariage ends in divorce will CA courts even honor the Mexican prenup? Is it best to just marry her in Mexico, fix papers, once here sign prenup and marry again in CA?

Harry

If you get a premuptial agreement in Mexico, it better be legal in California. Even if you sign a prenup in Mex that is not legal in California, and you get a divorce in CA, you might as well give the lady 1/2 of your money now.

Prenups are common in all of Latin America.

OH

"If you get a premuptial agreement in Mexico, it better be legal in California."

That is my question. With CA courts honor a prenup signed in MEX? Otherwise if divorce happens in CA = 50%.

Harry

Having had a prenup during for my second marriage, and still having something after I got divorced, I would say that it can be done.

Another thing you have to remember about a Prenup anywhere, is that your agreement is usually signed before a marriage, but that you need to keep doing the things as specificed after the marriage, and keep doing exactly as it says. If you do not keep doing what the prenup says after you are married, you will still be blown up.

I (this is not legal advice because I am not an attorney) suggest the following for getting marriage to your novia in Mexico:

1. Get an attorney in California to write up the agreement.
2. Get the agreement translated into Spanish.
3. Make sure that your Novia has an attorney in Mexico.
4. After you get it drawn up in California, have it reviewed by an attorney in Mexico.
5. After you have something that your CA attorney can live with, and that your Mexican attorney can live with, give your novia both the English, and spanish copies of the agreement.
6. Make sure that her attorney signs both the English and Spanish agreements, and that she has signed both of the agreements. Also, she needs a different Mexican attorney then your Mexican attorney. You are asking for problems in CA if her attorney is the same as yours.
7. Remember, you have more to loose then she does.
8. As a practical matter, if you are in love, and are married for the next 50 years, you will not need this agreement at the end of 50 years.
9. Of all agreements, prenups are the hardest to work out, hardest to keep in perspective while you are married, and can present many arguments after to get married.

Forget the Ca / Mex stuff. Just having a prenup does not necessaryily make life any easier after getting married. It many cases is just another thing to argue about.

OH


PS: Make sure that if you are ever going to get a divorce, that you file in California. I would not want to trust my divorce to a Mexican court.

Otrohombre...for someone who is not an attorney you gave him perfect advice...I am a family lawyer and I would have given the same advice. One thing you must know is that you cannot prevent the payment of child support on a prenup. The key is to purchase all of your major assets (house, stocks, etc.) before your marriage as to keep it characterized as separate property. Also never buy property in Mexico under her name as the court's in the U.S. have now jurisdiction over it and Mexico does not have CP laws as it relates to real property. In addition, never never never comingle funds with her. No joint accounts, no jointly owned anything. Never take money from an account or asset you had before marriage and use it to buy property during marriage or place it in a joint account. Also never trust a Mexican girl who says she is on the pill.

Blazers:

If he wants real protection, there are a few other things that HJ needs. The first is that CA courts will still view any income he receives as community. This can be fixed by having the prenuptual agreement state that HJ's income is his sole and separate property. So two other statements that the prenup needs are as follows:

1. All of HJ's income after marriage (salaried, income from investments, or anything hell as his sole and separate property) will remain as his sole and separate property.

2. All retirement plans (IRA's, pensions, etc) are to remain sole and separate property.

The best way for HJ to achieve this, or to carry it out after he gets married is to have a "his", "her", and "ours" checking accounts.

All monies HJ receives that is his sole and separate property needs to go into "his" account. Money can the be put into "our" account. At no time (this is forever HJ), should HJ let any of the money in "our" or "her" account go into "his" account. HJ also should not pay any communit debts out of "his" account. Community debts, or expenses, should only be paid out of "our" account.

HJ should also have a clause in his prenup that says that something about a wife's efforts helping HJ on any of "his" separate property does not make "his" property community property.

Blazer, I sure hope that HJ can understand what we are saying, or he might as week give his novia his underpants now.

OH

Thanks guys. Basically it's the properties, the savings account and 401k I have now that I'd like to protect. Drawing up a prenup here and having her sign it there was the part I had doubt in, but if U.S. law honors it then no need to worry?

Harry

BTW, I did trust her to be on the pill. It all came out ok in the end.

"1. All of HJ's income after marriage (salaried, income from investments, or anything hell as his sole and separate property) will remain as his sole and separate property."

OtroHombre you've disclosed that you're not an attorney but did you consult with one?

And Blazers have you represented clients who've managed to do this?

Very interesting thread. Thanks

Reytj

If someone is marrying a girl from another country that is not a native English speaker, and wants to establish a basic no-frills prenupt; how much money does he need to estimate at a minimum for all the attorney's fees. I would assume he needs an attorney, and that she needs an attorney and maybe a translator (or an attorney that speaks her native language.) Even if the man doesn't have many assets now, I bet it would be expensive... Am I wrong? Can it be done affordably?

And, what about the pre-made templated prenups you find on the internet? I assume with regards to these you get what you pay for.

Reytj:

I had a attorney draw it up. I also told him why I wanted it. I had also previously attended law school, and for most of my life have thought like one. I probably could have been an attorney, but quit law school during my first marriage because I was doing too many things, and I thought better to quit law school, and try and save the marriage.

I just never went back.

Guys, where Blazers has done this or not is not the most important thing. I think that Blazers is a reputable attorney, the most important thing after getting married is you. Just because you have an agreement will not save your ass. You have to do what the agreement says, or you blow up.

Most men with a prenup blowup because their honey says, oh honey you can trust me, or oh honey after the three years we have been married, or any number of reasons.

Another reason, is that men blow up is that they just think they can write a check from the community account, and put it in thier acct. Bad news. One dollar from the community account can turn your $22,000,000 sole and separate account into community property. Also, if you pay community debts out of your sole and separate property account, it just became a community debt. Also, if your community account make payments on your wifes accounts that she had before you were married, her debts are now community debts. If you pay your new wifes debts out of your sole and separate property account, her debts just became community debts also.

Another thing, your prenup may be the greatest one in the world, but to keep things straight, you new wife should pay her own debts out of her own account, and she should get her own credit for things. If you do not want to be responsible for her bills, never sign any of her credit apps.

You should only have your signature on debts that you really mean to be community debts.

There is also one other clause you want to get in your prenup. This clause may or may not stand up if attached, but you want a clause that says that money transfered from your wifes account, or the community account does not make your accounts community account. This will probably hold up for small dollar amounts, but if you are sucking the community account dry, and putting it in your account, a judge would probably ignore this statement.

A prenup is so technical, is that most people really do not understand what to do after the agreement is signed, and they are married.

OH

ps: Prenups are upheld by California courts, but there are many that are thrown out for any number of reasons. Because the number thrown out is so many, that it is really important to understand what to do have you have a prenup

You have to remember that a prenup is a contract between you and your wife to be. This is not any different then a commercial. How many commercial contract blow up for any number of reasons? It is not different with prenup otherwise known other places as "Marriage Contracts".

Wow, this has really turned into a very informative thread.

Harry

A certain active board member here once said that his co-worker lost his house after being married to a Vietnamese girl(he got her from Vietnam, not U.S.) for less then a year.

It bugged the hell out of me because my understanding is that in California the court heavily favors the U.S. citizen. Esp. in cases where the foreigner has been here less than 5 years. So how did the guy lose the house even if he did not have a pre-nup for such a short marriage?

Maybe Blazers or the board member(um.. Sancho) can enlighten us.

-DJ

If he lost his house he either did it voluntarily or put it under her name or quitclaimed it to her as a gift during the short marriage. If he bought it before marriage, then it is his separate property. She may be entitled to some of the increase in equity in a year but that's it. You don't just lose the house if you buy it before marriage or buy it during marriage. He could give it to her but she would have to take care of the mortgage and she would have to pay him his community equity in the house. Your friend is not telling you the entire story...sounds like the typical new client that comes into my office.
I also knew all of the other information regarding prenups but I did fail to mention that he cannot just deposit community income into a separate property account...this is where it commingles. I could give examples of what to do and what not to do all day but it would be at $250 an hour.

Gee Blazers, I had to tell my attorney what to write, and it did not cost me $250 / hr.

You may be worth it, but I am not paying it. You were the one that said I was correct.

Blazers, there are so many horny guys on this site bringing home wifes that you should be able to retire.

Sorry, but some of us, namely me, had this figured out. Oh well. You might have to move to WSG. I am not a member there.

OH

ps: For those of you that want an attorneys opinion, write to Blazer at $250 / HR.. For those of you that just want my opinion (Blazer said earlier that I know what I am doing), just write me, and I will give you my opinion.

Rememger, there is value in what you pay for. Since I am not charing anything, my opinion does not count for much.

My Colombian wife of 5 years has decided it's time to cash in her chips and move on. She
insinuated to me this morning that she is expecting that I will have to pay child support for "HER" 13 yr old son who came with her.
I have no problem paying whatever the law says
she's entitled to and I went into this with my eyes wide open knowing the odds were against me.
What pisses me off is to hear her using the
classic phrase "I'm a VICTIM".
The only thing I know for sure is that the
"Affidavit of Support" document that I signed
would be binding upon me for 3 years after
entry.
Any and all opinions from the board appreciated.
PS. I reside in a community property state.

She is only entitled to a community portion of estates you purchased during marriage. She may be entitled to some spousal support as you were married for 5 years. You are not obligated to pay child support for her 13 year old son(assuming its not yours) unless you adopted the child or are the childs legal guardian. If she has not yet received her green card, she will not be able to obtain one once you file for divorce unless she can claim domestic violence or abuse. Just because you signed an Affidavit of Support does not mean you have to pay child support or spousal support but you still may have to pay some spousal support until she gets deported or benefits from George Bush's bullshit Amnesty proposal. If you happen to give her a makeup fuck session, use a condom because she will soon find out that the only way she can ride the gravy train is having a child with you that is born in the USA. I repeat, you can cum in her mouth , her ear, her ass but NOT HER PUSSY. Sorry to be harsh, but I am a family attorney and must be blount to get the point accross.

No I'm not the father and I've been shooting
blanks for many years.
We've been living a Landlord/Tenant relationship
for several months now. Since I was told not to
touch her.
For the most part the only monthly expenses she's been required to pay (once she got a
job) was gas for the car and her long distance
phone bills.