I never said I was leaving Help alone. In fact, for all of the three incidents I refered to, I was leaving with a garota. Still, I've just about given up on the Help scene as well. The only time I find it enjoyable is during the Jan-Feb college break, when there are lots of students who are not hard core putas who show up to make a few reais to cover their vacation casts. Otherwise, it's the same old faces, night after night and year after year.

Maybe night after night the faces are the same for a while, but there's quite a turn-over over time. I've returned to Help after a only a few months on several occasions, and been hard-pressed to recognize more than the dozen or two regulars, who are there year after year.

With all due respect, there seems to be a bunch of wimps on this board. I've walked down Ave Atlantica, up Miguel Lemos from Help many times at all hours of the night, and I've never had any problems, or even witnessed any problems. The only problem I have is kids begging you for "un real," and even that seems to have lessened.

Johnshaft, don't try to be a hero.

But without the power to back up your hero status, it might become ridiculous.

It is already well known that a maior percentage of mongers get mugged at night near Help. It is not courage but stupidity to ignore these statistics.

If you are best friends with the local crime boss, or at least with the the police chief, and have their official protection, then maybe you can play a hero.

I remember the story of the Karate black belt, who thought he could resist the 12 year old mugger. Result: his 13 year old accomplice shot the black belt.

Almost all mugging fatalities are hero wannabes. They thought they could resist. Read the newspapers!

Now if you are the friend of the top crime boss, things are different. I heard stories about people telling a mugger that they are the friend/lawyer of a crime syndicate Boss. The mugger immediately backed off and asked for firgiveness.

If you are known to have protection, the crooks will know.

A few times already I have been sitting with favela programa girls on Av Atlantica, during day time. They told me that the local crime kids were asking them about me, trying to sort out if they should rob me or not.

Johnshaft,

It's easy to be a BSD and talk tough, but when you have three 17-year old kids around you, two with knives, it's a different situation. I'm in Rio often enough to know that there's been a pretty significant increase in muggings in the area around Help. Many guys on this board have been victims (Hemp, Bluestraveller, etc.). And BS lives just a few blocks away and knows the scene better than you or me. So if he says be cautious, guys probably ought to listen.

Safado69 your absolutely correct you GOT TO BE CAREFUL. While many of us don't know each other we want no hard to come to anyone. Read these posts carefully and especially newbies should be extra careful. Take nothing for granted and watch your back in this area. Enjoy this beautiful city for many years to come. - HempTextText

Walking alone makes you a target; walking with a garota may make you an even bigger target since you may be less likely to risk a fight (or run like hell which is what you should do if possible) if a garota is in tow.

Furthermore - watch those little kids as they are just as bad as the bigger guys. Don't forget that is their way of surviving. Hemp

I am not calling anyone a wimp. I am sure everyone who says they have had problems surely has. And BS and Sandman have forgotten more about Rio than I will ever know and their advice is always solid. But as I said in my report,over a 6 month period I very regularly walked from Help to Hotel L'Angrense or Hotel Bandeirantes, both near Avenue Santa Clara, and never had a problem, like JohnShaft writes. Sometimes I walked on Atlantica, sometimes the back streets. Maybe because it was always fairly early, I am not a late night type and was always back before 2AM. I wear no jewelry and very plain clothing, always. Would I recommend it? No, but I don't think you should panic in the area either.

Travelsrr,
The key point most guys have been making is that it's unsafe AFTER 1 A.M. or so. I've also never had a problem before 1:30 or 2, but any later and you're asking for problems. These days I'll err on the side of caution and take cabs even earlier, since there's been a real upswing in muggings over the past 6 months, but I and others agree that the later it gets, the more dangerous it is.

I've walked from Help to the Marriott after midnight several times and never had a problem. I stayed on Atlantico and stayed close to the street. The only things close to a problem there is fending off the piranha streetwalkers.

The main problem appears to be on the side streets within a few blocks of Help - Miguel Lemos, Xavier da Silveira, Djalma Ulrich and Almirante Goncalves - and Aires de Saldanha, the the street between NS Copa and Atlantico.

Hey Guys,

I'm not trying to be a hero, nor am I suggesting the experiences of our fellow mongers be ignored. I'm just stating my experiences.

I've come to Rio about 13 times for about the last year and a half, and I think it should be mentioned that I've been working at night for about 20 years; so, I think that qualifies me as a Night Owl.

Usually I find myself coming to Help around 12mid, and leaving around 4 or 5. My apartment is always on Nossa Senhora Copacabana next to the Savoy; so, Miguel Lemos is the quickest way to Help, and I go that way all the time, and I return to my apartment with Garotas all the time. I've walked in Centro, Gloria, down Ave Atlantica from Princessa Isabel many times at the same hours of the morning. Seen Garotas leaving Help who couldn't weigh more than a buck 05 walking alone, and throughout all these experiences I've never witnessed a hint of a problem. People wave, smile and sometimes engage in interesting conversations with me.

Of course, I realize my experience is not the only experience. Could be that I'm lucky, or maybe it's because I could be described as a darker, 190lb version of Mike Tyson; thus, I could probably pass for a Brazilian, and I think people think twice about fucking with me. One thing's for sure, I'm not in tight with no local crime boss.

Anyway, I do think Rio can be dangerous for some who don't fit a certain profile -- A young, Asian friend of mine who weighs about a 140lbs, should never walk alone -- and me, I'm always careful, but those experiences are my true experiences; thus, until I find a reason to be fearful, I will continue to do what I've always done.

John Shaft

I posted this in the chat too.

Summary: 17 German tourists and 2 Australians were robbed on the way from Rio airport



Imprimir

Turistas atacados na Linha Vermelha dizem que não voltam mais à cidade

Alba Valéria Mendonça, Cristiane de Cássia e Selma Schmidt

Sem dinheiro, sem documentos, com as mesmas roupas desde domingo e traumatizados. O agente de turismo Guy Batten, de 38 anos, e o técnico de informática Lon Wright, de 44, não vêem a hora de voltar hoje para a Austrália. Os dois turistas foram assaltados domingo à noite por três homens armados, um deles de fuzil, que fecharam o carro onde eles estavam na Linha Vermelha. O crime aconteceu um dia depois de outro assalto a um grupo de turistas na saída da mesma via expressa.

Os assaltos aconteceram no caminho entre o Aeroporto Internacional e hotéis na Zona Sul. O comandante do BPTur, tenente-coronel Luiz Antônio Corso, disse apenas que as polícias Civil e Militar estão reunindo dados sobre os dois assaltos.

O Passat que levava os australianos do aeroporto ao Hotel Marriott, em Copacabana, foi abordado na altura da Estação de Tratamento de Esgoto do Caju. Três bandidos estavam num Fiat Stilo. Segundo as vítimas, os ladrões eram homens jovens e não estavam mal vestidos.

— Fiquei com medo de morrer naquela hora — lembrou Lon.

Na noite anterior, as vítimas foram 17 alemães que chegavam num microônibus de turismo. O veículo tinha saído da Linha Vermelha e passava pelo Elevado da Perimetral, em São Cristóvão, quando foi fechado por um Golf preto com quatro homens. Dois ladrões entraram no microônibus e obrigaram o motorista a seguir o Golf enquanto roubavam as bolsas de mão e ameaçavam os turistas de morte.

Os dois assaltos foram registrados na Delegacia de Atendimento ao Turista (Deat), no Leblon. Para o professor da Fundação Getúlio Vargas e ex-ministro do Turismo Caio Luiz de Carvalho esses assaltos vão causar danos monumentais à imagem do Rio no exterior. Mais do que isto, vão manchar também a imagem do Brasil:

— O turista estrangeiro quando é assaltado fora do seu país fica totalmente indefeso, se sente humilhado em toda a sua plenitude. Ele fica sozinho, sem saber a quem recorrer, não conhece as leis e não domina a língua do país.

O secretário municipal de Turismo, Rubem Medina, afirmou que qualquer notícia negativa atrapalha o turismo:

— Tentamos minimizar o impacto demonstrando o potencial do Rio, mas é fundamental um maior cuidado com a segurança — disse Medina.

http://oglobo.globo.com/jornal/rio/146624896.asp Voltar Topo

While its certainly statistically more dangerous the later it gets, folks have been mugged in broad daylight too. Last year I was walking on the side walk next to the beach along Copa toward Leme, at around noon, with hundreds of people around, and two kids tried to rob me. ONe walked up to me almost in my face. When I moved to the left to avoid contact, his accomplice previously unseen comes from out of nowhere, and sticks his hand in my left pocket, the runs like hell. Fortunately, he didnt get anything, as I was wearing cargo shorts with deep pockets and sunscreen on top. I was however very surprised to have this happen in daytime with many people around.

Pickpockets work at any time of the day. In fact, the more people the better. It's easier to get lost in the crowd. The good ones can pick your pocket in a fraction of a second and be gone just as quickly. There are probably more pickpockets working the streets between the two entrances to Lojas Americana (Ruas Magalhes and Copacabana) during the peak crowd times than anywhere else.

Well it was bound to happen, I was walking rua aires saldanha around midnight after eating dinner.
Between Help and Rio Othon, I hear some footsteps behind me, I look back and see some shape 2 steps behind me, I check my right and see this young 20 walking on the street, we make eye contact. Somehow despite being tired, I react and start sprinting. They start chasing me. It´s not even close as I have soccer speed so they give up after 20 yards. I felt his f. rush of adrenaline and felt very lucky. I felt good as I had no cc and only about R$30 on me. I know the policia is currently everywhere on ns copa, every block, but this street is not covered every night according to 1 garota so I will walk on atlantica and turn by Othon from now on. If someone knows about policia schedule or best strategy, please post. I have no idea where the policia is on this street. I would have given my wallet had I been grabbed but no way was I going to give myself up just by being approached.

Man I walk that street all the time at night. There is a little bar there I like to hang at. Thanks for the heads up, I will stay on Atlantica too.

Athos when I walk that way, I first stop at the newspaper kiosk to browse, and to see if anyone is following me. Before I head down Aires Saldanha.

Or you can walk by the Othon Palace, say hello to their private security guy's, and tip him a couple of Reias, to watch you as you walk down the block.

I dont think they guard that side any more at the Othon.
I saw a local stare at me by Help during the day. Would not surprise me if one of the ladrao.
After Bangkok, I feel very unsafe in rio... In SP I feel safer as no one knows i am a monger.

It'll be awhile before you get over your first mugging. You are at the "everyone is a potential mugger" stage.

At 6'5" and 280 lbs I would ring the neck of any 12-year beach mugger who tried to rob me. It's been tried before by guys 6'2", college power dringers in bars, and I got the first punch off quick. That ended very quickly. I don't think I will have much problemas in Rio, or will I???!!!

I heard a friend of mine just got mugged outside of Help by the hotdog stands, by three thugs. And three cops were close by.

BigLeo, its the multiple muggers you should be wary of, and them packing knifes or more?

BigLeo,

First off, drunken college kids do not live day to day trying to find food for themselves or their extended family as do these muggers. There are plenty of muggers who are big enough to put you out. Street punks in the states will tell you how they are going to kick ur ass before they do it. In brazil they will just blow you away.. Just be smart and stay in control of your alcohol consumption if you are rolling solo.

I totally agree. ALWAYS keep your guard up regardless of your size. Bigleo while I'm sure your size could be intimidating to some you still have to always watch your back especially watch the little street kids also. Anyone and I repeat anyone can be the victim of a mugging here in Rio. Carry as little cash as you can, no flashy jewelry, no camera's or exposed cell phones on your belt. If accosted throw a little money in the air and run like hell. A few bucks will not be worth it to spoil your trip and IMHO the cops will do nothing at all. - Hemp

Being 6'5" just makes you a bigger target when the shooting starts. And, as has been stated, the kids operate in packs, so while one or two aren't really a problem, six are a bit much to deal with.

I haven't witnessed an actual mugging - someone getting hit up the side of their head or anything - but on Thursday night, I believe, I was walking on Barata Ribeiro around 8:30 PM and a woman got her bag taken by a snatch-and-run team. That's the main thing you see, pickpockets and sneak-thieves. Size and/or fighting ability doesn't do you any good if some kid snatches your wallet or cell phone or whatever and heads off to a safe spot.

Hemp, that's a good idea--throw a bunch of bills in the air and run like hell. I'll remember that, and keep a separate, easily accessible wad of 1s and 2s. Thanks.

Your welcome Hunterman but that was taught to me by a real pro in Rio "Sandman" you are da man! - Thanks Hemp

LOL, Sandman told us the same thing all they are looking for is cash. Keep a pocket full of loose 2's, 1's in a seperate pocket from your big cash and if accosted just make it rain money and run. They'll get R$20-30 and you get away with the most of your cash and a healthy body.

Plus a good adrenaline rush (a free high).

Bigleo

a few stories.

My 5th degree black belt Jiu Jitsu teacher tells me that he will not do a thing when he sees a kid robbing an old lady. And this guy is an intelligent and socially concerned person.

He told me about a black belt teacher who tried to catch a snatcher. He ran after the kid. When he reached the kid, the kid turned around and just blew him away with one shot. The kid got acutally caught and was locked up for a few months and now is back on the street.

If the "good" actually wins and catches the thief, then comes the next problem. You might be a mark for a future revenge killing. A guy I knew got killed with 12 bullets by 3 guys 2 weeks ago. But he probably angered people more important then plain street muggers.

I grew up in a country where you are not supposed to be a coward. But here it is safer to be a coward.

Your size helps, but don't feel invulnerable. The guys that get shot are those who fight back.

Update from an earlier post:

Just returned from Rio, and as usual, I stay at the same apartment (next to sendas) on nossa senhora copacabana. One night I was walking home with my girl up miguel lemos, and I noticed this dude scoping me out. I turned looked at him and he looked away. I started walking again, and through my excellent peripheral vision, I noticed he was trying to get behind me. I turned and gave him the death stare, and he said "nao problemo." I kept staring at him for a moment, and said, "Eu sei." And walked into my apartment.

For what it's worth, in two years of mongering in Rio, going to practically every place imaginable, at all hours of the night, that's the closest I've ever gotten to an altercation.

I'll walk all over Copa/Ipanema at any hour IF I'm by myself. If anything gets too close to me, I'm ready to run. However, if I'm with a girl, I always take a taxi, even if it's only one block. Just don't fell right sprinting away if I'm with a girl.

Similar situation happened to me and a buddy. We were walking back to his apartment around the corner from Miea Pataca from Help with 2 garotas on tow. Some guy was scoping us out as we walked past Miea Pataca and said something to the girls and they freaked out and said to grab a taxi. We took a cab around the block. The girls were saying that this guy and his buddies has been robbing people for a few weeks there. Better safe than sorry. A $2 taxi fare was a lot better than getting beat up and robbed of much more.

Thanks for all the advice....I will be making my first Brazil trip in August and luckily with a couple of experienced guys who can probably pass for Brazilians. But I would not pass for one if I tried. Blond hair, light eyes etc. I already bought a money stash that goes on the inside of my pants and will probably try to wear a hat and long sleeves as well. At least I can run very fast and I am in good shape.

Wearing a hat and long sleeves will really help you blend in with the locals. Good plan.

you will carry a few thousand US$$ inside your pants at night? The girls will find out and thell their criminal friends. They will be very happy.

I know some guys don't trust their apartments and carry their money always with them. I suggest, instead, don't get an apartment without a number-locked safe.

No Brazil Specialist, I will not carry all my cash in my stash. I will put many low denomiation dollars in a pocket so it will look like a thief scored if I get robbed. My ID, some more bills will be hidden. The bulk left in a safe. Shit, you could possibly get robbed on your way from the airport to the hotel. My white, blond, light-eyed ass is going to cut down on the possibily as much as possible

Vagabond,

Why would you carry dollars around? Other than entry for Help, they do you no good whatsoever in Brasil, unless you exchange them for reals.

I was using the term "dollars" in a general sense...I will not carry US dollars around. Hell, I may carry a wad of play money and throw it in the wind if I am chased and watch them stop to pick it up as I make my escape...lol

I am not actually "that" paronoid!

Taking a cab around the corner??

I do note that you didn't provide an address... so not to address anyone personally, and I know Rio can be quite dangerous,

but anyone taking a taxi from MP to Miguel Lemos 8 isn't being safe, they're being crazy. Same for from Help to ML 8. Hell, you can get hit walking from MP to the taxi as easily as from MP to the apartment.

Maybe around the corner and down 1-2 blks, that's a different story.

Theorhetically it was around the block but as you know all the streets in Copacabana besides Atlantica are one way.

We back-tracked by footr up Atlantica to Alcazar after the altercation just to be in a more populaed area and taxi'd (using a known taxi driver) from there South on Atlantica to the 1st street we could make a right on and back down NS Copacabana to the street that Othon Palace and Blame it on Rio is on not sure of the name of that street but the apartment was across the street from Tudo Facil internet cafe.

Is that enough of an explaination????

i taxi all the time from help to the princess for R5 or$2. cheap price for safety. if you don't taxi in copa after dark espessially after 11 pm, you are asking for trouble. for every story here are many unreported. watch your ass and shoes 24/7 in copa.

taking a taxi to Miguel Lemos 8 might be exaggerated. But not totally paranoid. You can get mugged right at the corner of ML and Atlantica.

For maximum paranoia, I would make friends with a security guard or at least a permanently stationed taxi driver. Give them a few R$ to escort you to the door by foot.

That's why we hoofed it back to Alcazar. Rodrigo, their security guard is pretty good and there is a taxi driver Roberto that works nights that I like to use.

I heard a story on another of an MP girl named Adrianna being killed recently (past 24-48 hours). Supposedly she was the snitch on the boat ride bust. Does anyone have any info on this? BTW, whats the exchange rate goin for these days? on www.xe.com I'm getting 2.38 to the USD.

The girl was snitch for whom? No need to turn in the boat people, they were plain to see. Nobody tipped off Kenn well enough or else he would have stopped. So who would kill her???

got 2.50 at the cambio (special incremented rate, normal was 2.48) and 2.39 (I think) at the ATM.

According to another poster on another board (who was on the boat ride) that this girl adrianna snitched to the cops in advance about the boat party. I'm not sure if I believe that or not but is there anyword if a garrota was killed over the past couple of days?

Guy, who needed a snitch in this case? It was in plain view for all to see.

i don~t know anything about the situation but the guys on the website said she left early and they thought she informed the police the party was going on at that time. who knows.

anyway, one story to tell, not unlike many on here. a few days ago, i had a terma girl over from a terma i don~t go to much (and i did not know her too well either). so we go to dinner and to my place for the night, i had about 100 reais in my pocket and i counted it before we returned. instead of locking my money, cc, etc. up as i usually do, i left it in my pocket because it wasn~t much money, she was a terma girl, and i was a little drunk. the next morning after i got dressed i looked in my pocket and the money was gone (but everything else in the pocket was there). anyway, i immediately began searching around the apartment everywhere for the money because i knew i had it, and after about 20 minutes of searching the girl found it under the bed. it was her opinion that i must have thrown my pants down the night before and the money flew out of my pocket under the bed (although nothing else was under the bed that had been in my pocket, and the spot was about 3 feet from where i put my pants, and i usually don~t throw my pants down with enough force to cause this). anyway, i got my money back, but i will be on guard in the future. i would be surprised if she did try to take it for a number of reasons (it was the only money in my pocket so she knew i would discover it was missing, i know where she works, she knows i am in rio a lot and i know some of her friends, she seems like an honest girl, i paid her well, etc.) but this magic money theory doesn~t seem plausible to me either. anyway, other than this she was terrific but i won~t be going with her again just because now i am a little paranoid about her.

just wanted to add another story to the archives. in my opinion, if you don~t give the girls an opportunity to rob you by leaving things out, etc. things will go much smoother but i broke my own rule.

assuming you have locked most everything up at night, when the garota uses the bathroom roll up your pants and put them under your matress near your pillow. you may have a few wrinkles the next day but even if she drugs you she will have to roll you on to the floor to get your money. retreive when she showers in am.