Sean Alexander will wear a Seahawks uniform again, next year. I'd almost guarantee it. As a lifelong Steelers fan (and the kind of football fan who sets his alarm for 8 am to watch the MNF game live in Bangkok, notwithstanding the fact that I generally hit the sack at around 6 am) it pains me to say that this is, in all likelihood, the Colts' year. Colts/Steelers? I laid the 7 and a half and raked the jack. In fact, I bet against my team, and won again, this week versus Cincinatti. The Steelers aren't going to do it, this year. Our offense doesn't have the fire-power. I'm hoping that the Colts run the board (Manning and Harrison both exude class). If nothing else, they'll finally shut the '72 'Phins up. And that's long overdue...

Manos.

Well Mando, as a fellow Steeler fan I will disagree with you to a certain extent. One thing is for certain...nobody is going to beat Indy this year.

As far as the Stellers firepower goes, it has only and ONLY to do with having a top QB missing 5 games and playing the rest of the season with a broken thumb. When the Steelers were with a healthy Rothlesberger they beat Cincinatti and San Diego on the road. When he is healthy, they are a complete team and were the #2 team in Power Rankings after the San Diego game...after hurting his knee and then surgery on the other knee and then the broken thumb(and yes its broken). The only legit losses IMHO are the home game against NE and the Indy game. Remember they lost two games in overtime with Maddox at the helm and playing the worst two games by a QB this year.

And before you guys chalk that up to sour grapes, take away any QB of that caliber off of any of the top teams now and they would be a disaster, including the Chargers and Colts. Steelers are young and have their nucleus in tact...they will be back to having unreal regular seasons and choking in the playoffs as long as Cowher is alive.

Your assessment is not, in my opinion, far off, Blazers. I saw those Maddox games and he was, in a word, pathetic. How much worse could Charlie Batch have been, really? Hell, how much worse could Randel-El have been? That being said, even though the guy was a bit of a prick, I really think having Plaxico in the lineup this year would have made a significant difference. Rothlisberger is a good NFL quarterback. His pocket presence, particularly for a young guy, is astounding. That being said, he isn't, at least at this point in his career, an elite NFL quarterback. If we fall behind by two touchdowns, I'm never confident that we can come back. I think we need at least one more difference maker on offense. Until that happens, I don't see us going all the way.

Manos.

Well, how many elite QB's are there in the NFL? Peyton Manning and Tom Brady are the only ones that pops into my mind right away. I mean, how good are NFL QB's when Matt Hasselbeck and Drew Bledsoe will likely be in the Pro Bowl for the NFC. The only QB who is approaching elite status might be Drew Brees. Pitt needs one receiver and a brand new coach to win the whole thing again. They will not likely win a SB with Cowhere there...he just doesnt have what it takes.

ahh hell-- what about doughboy mcflab and dante inferno dullpepper?

Jake the bobblehead is looking like he ate some wheaties.

Porker

DENADA

I might actually toss Carson Palmer onto that list soon...although that is based alot on the other offensive weapons he has around him. I'm still not sold on Brees. Cowher, admittedly, made some bad calls in the Indy game. I don't think we would have won the game if he'd called it perfectly. But he certainly didn't put us in a position to win. That being said, year in and year out we seem to be in the playoffs. I think he's a very good coach for the type of offense we run. We do need another receiver, though. I really thought that if Plaxico could have pulled his shit together, he would have been ideal. Another decent corner wouldn't hurt either...

Manos.

great call-- Palmer is very impressive thus far.

Agreed, Palmer looks to be elite but he needs one more season to prove it and hasnt had a post season, same goes for Brees. McNabb and Culpepper not elite...just a step below.

I said mcflab and dullpepper with jest. They r the physical types that are always billed as the next gen QBs with far superior talent. I'll take a white guy who sits in the pocket, plays on grass/likes to get muddy, got stuble, with a arm anyday.



(Message edited by donmarco on December 10, 2005)

Don Marco,

I guess that black guys aren't cut out to be QBs in the NFL. Please don't tell that to Byron Leftwich.

Example-- Vick is by far one of the most athletic QBs ever. Would I take him over brady-- NO WAY. Hell Vick wouldn't even be in my top 7 choices.

It's not black vs. white per se', it's more of the big hyper althletic QB vs. the grity, slow, field general with a strong arm. Athletic QBs running all day trying to make something happen are good in college. Then again so is the wishbone.

Byron has a lot to prove in terms of being an NFL talent. He is tough, I'll give him that.

Explorer, I disagree with your premise, but if you want to leave the politically correct crap behind, in all seriousness, there has never been a black quarterback in the history of pro football that was anything more than a minor blip in the history of the game. Warren Moon and Cunningpepper looked good in fantasy games, though. And Mike Vick and McNabb certainly show promise if they could only stay healthy.

Very entertaining article about pro football and finishes off with some gambling picks.

Sorry, maximus, but it's not very complimentary toward your the horrid Jets.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/051209

San Diego and Dallas are very similar teams, IMO, clearly GOOD and capable of beating pretty much any one on any given day, but waaay too inconsistent and can find ways to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, like they lack leadership and confidence at all the wrong times.

Prescient comment about San Diego yesterday. The Dolphins are also a schizo team w's over both SD and Denver this year. But I bet they're dangerous next year if they get ANY sort of serviceable QB.

Dont kid yourselves Charger fans...that was a win against a team that had everything wrapped up and is not the same team that was undefeated this year. Its not an excuse, its just the facts. Chargers play that game two weeks ago and Colts win by three touchdowns. Look for the Chargers to lose in KC next week and end their season.

Chargers do have the talent to win the whole thing but they wont do it until they fire Schottenheimer who is a horrible post season coach. Even if Chargers win next week, they lose the tie breaker with the Steelers..game over.

They held one of the greatest offenses of all time scoreless in the first half, much like New England did last year in the playoffs, hit Manning a few times and had him rushing to throw. The Diem injury hurt, but the Colts pass protection was BRUTAL. If that continues, Indy ain't gonna win anything this year.

I bet it doesn't continue, though.

And you're right, though, Blazers: Chargers won't make the playoffs as J'Ville and Pittsburgh can sleepwalk into the playoffs with wins the next 2 weeks.

How bout those patriots? ;)

Patriots played great yesterday against the Florida boys in the cold. It's certainly better to be peaking this time of year than in October.

Hey Da Bears with Ole man Rex in there are a whole nother story. If he gets in rhythm and the D keeps playing like they are ,we could see another Super Bowl Shuffle this year !! Vick was totally taken out of this game from the opening snap.

Da Bears completed my second three team parley for the weekend . lost a couple of others but oh well.

The girls in AC and at Morning Night in BKK are going to be very happy in February !!

To show you how much better the AFC is over the NFC. The Steelers just crushed the two hottest teams in the NFC back to back(Chicago's 8 game winning streak and Minn. 6 game streak) and the Steelers might barely make the playoffs. San Diego who might not make the playoffs would be the front runner to win the NFC as would any other team in the AFC who is in the playoffs. The one exception might be the Panthers who are legit and cant beat just about anyone if they have their A game.

Chiefs 0-2 last 2 weeks against NFC East. Jacksonville beat the friggn' 49ers today by 1 point. It depends on the teams as far as that generalization goes.

interested to know how ben graham the kicker for the jets is going this season . he was renowned for being a booming kick in australia in the aussie football -

also baseball is my game and passion - any threads open during season

no need for assistance - found the baseball site and read with interest - gunna love it

Ben Graham's doing pretty well, especially for a first year punter. His punting average is excellent, though not the best in the NFL. Could he be the next Darren Bennett?

thanks porker - bennett family are fine sportsmen as younger brother represented aust in baseball at olympics and piched a little in the majors in the states - just watched colts lose first game on austar(fox) - first time i have seen coach td interviwed post game - impressive open and honest

Favre's playing like an idiot. Boller's playing like a young Favre. What's wrong with this world?

Good luck to the skins and their fans today.

Also, please don't tell me how "lucky" the shitty, ole, and depleted Pats are anymore... hehehe

The Pats just got home-towned and raped on a pass interference call that led to a Denver touchdown. That was a call that should have been offensive pass intereference..if anything and the flag was thrown near 5 minutes after the play ended...hope this doesnt decide the game as NE looks to be the better team so far.

Agree about the penalty. Too bad there's no replay on such shit in the playoffs, the call was a JOKE.

New England looks OK when they're holding onto the damned ball. getting in the end zone sure would helpt them, though.

Well, hold on the ball and stop throwing pics returned for TD's! OOPS!

Sometimes its better to be lucky than good and I have yet to see a team get so outplayed and WIN.....but dems da breaks....fumbles are part of the luck of the game as are bad calles(ie pass interference and ball going through the end zone on Bailey's pick) but usually those breaks go the Patriots way...not this year.

That was a game I need to register with the X Files. It was a wierd game to say the least.

The call was a freaken joke, and while officiating is normally a zero sum game, it definetely altered the score and momemtum. After that, that pats executed fairly well, but made critical errors, which are hardly immaginable... All Denver points on turnovers says it all. 14 points with ~2 yards offensive output. Brady, brown, and vinney are making costly errors at critical junctures...

Thanks to the pats for an exciting year and putting forth 110%-- there will be next year.

WHAT a game-- gratz to the steelers who beat them up and down the field all day. I'm glad to see even pathetic officials and Cower(ard) play calling couldn't screw it up.

Bears: Game over. Shoulda covered that Smith guy. See ya next year, fighting for .500.

Fox sports just told me that 1st time playoff QB's are 0-4 thus far in the playoffs with 6 picks in the 4 games. Grossman's #'s not included...

DOLTS! Too dumb to even be on ESPN!

This just in....Ben Rothlisberger is the real fucking deal. His improvement this year from last years post season is huge. He can throw under pressure, in the pocket, rolling to his left or right and has the arm strength and touch for a short game or throwing the ball downfield. As bad as Cowher is in the post season and as bad as the officiating has been, Ben is still good enough to overcome those problems...granted he is nowhere close to the level of Tom Brady but he is not that far from being a top notch QB..not far at all.

He's gonna be good for a long, long time, as you said mid-last season, Blazers.

Watched that Steelers game live, in my bar, from 1- 4 a.m. with another hardcore Steelers fan, and a handful of Brits who couldn't really work out what was going on, but wanted the free drinks they were getting as my pal and I were ringing the bell after every Steelers score. The game was so damned exciting that even the Thai girls and the Brits were going bat-shit at that ending. Now to Mile High...

Manos.

Well at least the Steelers came out to play yesterday.

Indy. Peyton has a long way to go before he's in the same league as Brady. Calling out the O-line and whining post game-- LOL. Is this Levy's Bills in disguise? At least the bills played some serious shit teams (e.g., cowboys/giants).

Carolina-- we'll see how they do against a real team next week. Good luck to Seattle-- I hope they knock the snot outa the Panthers.

Bears--Did the bears D OD on Valium and Happy Pizza yesterday? They sure the fuck looked like it. Hey Lovie-- perhaps lend a little FS support to the DB putz covering Smith? What a joke. Rex and Jones were the only bright spots all day.

DM
A dismal performance by the Bear's defense for sure. The Panthers have a single reciever who can hurt you and I still cannot understand why he was not double and triple teamed every play !! At least move Nathan Vasher from side to side to match up with Smith. Who else is going to beat you -- Ricky Proehl ?? My grandma could cover him when he was in his prime !! The multiple injuries in the secondary finally caught up with them . A rookie corner from some school I have never heard of was one on one against Smith on the play where he just flew bu the twisted foot inept DB.

Grossman showed some promise but also showed his inexperience in many key situations. All in all a pretty decent year for a team predicted to finish LAST in it's division going into the season.

As for Peyton- I think he showed once again his true colors throwing his O line under the bus after the game. I'm getting sick of watching his wild pointing and gesticulating at the line - acting like he is singlehandedly directing every player's moves and assigning blocks. His ego needs a major adjustment.

It's a good thing Big Ben can tackle too! Of course the guy LOOKED like he got stabbed in the leg the way he was wobbling before Ben put him out of his misery on that inSANE faumble return at the end of the game. That was the single biggest fuck up I have ever seen in a WON game, and even though the Steelers won, I hope they rub Bettis' nose in that at every hall of fame discussion about him. IMO he's a poor man's Curtis Martin, and Martin has done nothing but be the Don Sutton of the running back position.

Re: Manning: What was he supposed to say? "I did a poor job of getting out of the way of the jailbreak?"

Gotta wonder where the running plays disappeared to in the playbook, though. James went OFF on the one drive where they actually fed him the ball.

To say that Bettis is a poor man's Curtis Martin when they arent even remotely close to being the same type of back shows how little you actually know about football inside the lines Porker. I guarantee you if you ever played football you would much rather go againt Curtis Martin on defense than Jerome Bettis. He is a freak. He has full back strength with tail back agility and footwork. He has been continually one of the best RB's in the league for a while...even last year in a limited role, he nearly gained 1,000 yards and played in the Pro Bowl..his 6th.

1000 yards means 60 stinkin' yards a game, one of the most overrated stats in sports. Any starting back in the NFL can do that even if they're getting 3 yards a carry. They ran a list of Pittsburgh's single season rushing leaders yesterday, and Bettis had a whopping THREE seasons over 1300 yards. Nowhere near HOF material. Ironhead Hayward was a load too. So what? If Bettis was so damned great, where are the numbers?

Oh, and Blazers, you sound like Al Bundy when you start the "I played the game" crap!

"Re: Manning: What was he supposed to say?"

Answer: "I didn't play nearly well enough to win. My accuracy and timing was off. I make no excuses for that terrible performance, I let the Colts and my fans down"


"That was the single biggest fuck up I have ever seen in a WON"

Bettis looked like Earnest Byner in disguise! Thank you Ben! IMHO opinion Bettis is and has ALWAYS been wayyy overated. I would take martin in a heartbeat if they were both at year one. And blazers, yes I played D for 9 years.


"He has been continually one of the best RB's in the league for a while...even last year in a limited role, he nearly gained 1,000 yards and played in the Pro Bowl..his 6th."


Blazers, comparing the O line from the steelers to the jets/patriots and the play calling selections from the teams over the years is also a joke. Come on dude... I coulda run for 1k yards in my prime behind that line.

The bus shoulda been thrown under da bus long ago. HOF is a joke at times as it is based on perception/fan support more than reality.

Well I never said Bettis is better than Payton, Sanders or Brown but he is an equal to Martin. Statistically Martin rarely gets runs over 10 yards....he compiles his yards by having an overabundance of carries and usually has a low average per carry stat. He is a warrior and a gamer but he is not a improved version of Bettis. Ask any coach in the league whom he would rather have in his prime and you would probably get a split down the middle between the two backs. The difference is that there is no back to compare to Bettis because he is a freak of nature...the only one to come to mind is Earl Campbell and Bettis is not at the level of Campbell IMHO. Curtis Martin should be compared more to Marcus Allen as they both can read holes well and know how to use blocking lanes properly.

And with regards to the Al Bundy comment...whether you realize it or not Porker, playing the actual sport and having to study playbooks does expose you to areas of the game that the non-athlete is never exposed to.....it's a simple as that.

martin has had to make a livin creating his own space, whereas the steelers gave the bus some beacu holes over the years... afterall he's a N/S runner. Bettis is not even close to being in Cambell's league...

What's this about martin's low average per carry??????


3.9 YPC for Bettis (only 5 years with a 4+YPC av)
4.0 YPC for Martin!!!

Nod martin

how many HOF running backs have under a 4.0YPC average?

TDs:
martin 90 rushing
Bus 91

comment wash, but like I said the Bus had been a goal line weapon and has had the luxury of a MUCH better O line.

Receiving:
martin 3300 + yards, 10 TDs.
bus 1400 yards, 3 TDs.

Big nod to martin, hands and the bus are not usually used in the same sentence...

speaking of hands...


fumbles:

martin 1 fumble per 139 carries average.
bus 1 fumble every 84 carries



Bettis is not HOF material. Period.

Comparing Curtis to Allen is not reasonable-- Allen is one of the 10 best of all time.


Speaking of the best (in order according to DM):

Payton
brown
dickerson
sanders
OJ
e. cambell
b. jackson
tony dorsett
marcus allen
marshall SIR Faulk

Martin's numbers kick the crap out of Bettis' due to far better durability. That was the whole point. And that Martin's longevity based numbers aren't all that impressive either. Being DECENT for a long time (a la Don Sutton) shouldn't be a ticket to the hall of fame for either of them, but there are plenty of clowns in the hall of fame in football, so who knows, as martin may approach 15,000 rushing yards.

As DM points out also, Bettis was a ZERO in the passing game, the ultimate one dimensional back.

Blazers, sorry, but your pee wee football experience doesn't make you any sort of expert in my eyes. Of course any MORE experience and you actually LOSE IQ points due to the dumb jock factor... Maybe Maximus could find a spot for you on his softball team, though. He's always talking about how that makes him some sort of baseball genius!

DM, Bo Jackson? A handful of games at the pro level isn't enough of a sample size to give him such lofty status, IMO. He never proved he could carry any sort of NFL load.

Personally I have a huge Dickerson bias because I saw him all the time as a teenager and can't believe anyone could possibly be better. And O.J. was always my idol. Tomlinson's gotta be on that list somewhere already.